r/PoliticalDebate • • 5d ago

Weekly Off Topic Thread

1 Upvotes

Talk about anything and everything. Book clubs, TV, current events, sports, personal lives, study groups, etc.

Our rules are still enforced, remain civilized.

**Also, I'm once again asking you to report any uncivilized behavior. Help us mods keep the subs standard of discourse high and don't let anything slip between the cracks.**


r/PoliticalDebate • • 3h ago

Political Theory What are your thoughts on the Horseshoe theory? Do you consider any far right figures similar to far left figures? Where on the spectrum do you place Bernie Sanders and Ron Paul?

4 Upvotes

I have seen many horseshoe theory claims, that far right and far left are similar. When considering authoritarian leaders like Hitler and Stalin, there are many similarities between them (mass murderers).

Would you consider horseshoe theory as a valid theory for US politics?

I also saw right wing pro-Israel political influencers post a version with Bernie Sanders and AOC (plus many others) on the far left, with Tucker Carlson and Candace Owens and MYG (plus many others) on the far right. Do you think it’s harsh to include Bernie sanders on far-left? If not, do you think Ron Paul is far-right?


r/PoliticalDebate • • 2h ago

Our politicians should be able to pass tests prior to being allowed on any ballot

3 Upvotes

There should be an assessment of general knowledge, civics, science, math, and for state and national levels, a psychiatric evaluation required prior to any person being allowed to place their name onto any ballot for election to any office.

The criteria of the test will depend upon the locality being governed. If a small town of 300 people need a mayor, then the test will be written/advised by those members of the town.

County seat . . . county test.

State seat, state test. . . and so on.

The test questions can be presented by anyone within that area, and the answers must be testable, or verifiable. Examples: IE No questions about which 'god" is correct, but yes questions about the earth revolves around the sun (which 25% of USA citizens get incorrect). Test questions will be examined and answered by a consensus of experts in that field. Historians for history questions, scientists for science questions, etc. If a consensus of 2/3 can not be reached the question is discarded. The test itself will be comprised of questions voted on to be included by the oral population being governed and can be as long or short as the population agrees to make it by popular vote.

The psych test can be administered by 3 different psychologists in good standing, chosen at random from the state or nation. 3 out of 3 or 2 out of 3 to pass.

Until a person meets this criteria they are ineligible for election.

This is my position and I offer it for debate. If i read any comprehensive and succinct rebuttals I will engage them in a 1-1 discussion on that thread.


r/PoliticalDebate • • 1h ago

Question Are there people on here that are anti democratic?

• Upvotes

I’m in college for political science and history and my education has led me to believe that democracy is fundamentally flawed, I don’t think it’s inherently a bad system but I feel as though people are very naive when it comes to democracy, thinking that it’s the superior system and pushing for more and more democratic institutions when public opinion isn’t always the correct opinion. Is there anyone else on here that agrees with me and if so what are your ideal systems? Again I’m not completely anti democracy but I think keeping checks on public opinion when mob rule has been demonstrated historically is a good idea


r/PoliticalDebate • • 8h ago

Political Theory Electric energy is the future and a advantage for both competitive economies and working class both.

3 Upvotes

Most of the global economy rests on the backbone of the Middle East and Russian oil to literally fuel their economy by providing transportation to and from work.

Gas prices rise and fall depending on the global market and a huge critical role is the relationship between the countries involved in business for this oil. Gas prices rise and fall dramatically as we've seen with the war in the Middle East and the sanctions on Russia at the beginning of the Ukraine war.

Big oil also plays a major role, price fixing the market to extract as much profit for as long as possible from the consumers by holding the prices high beyond what the market dictates, and then enforcing that the prices never drop too low again. Typical corporate greed that we see everywhere.

Dependency on the international market makes prices in countries harder to control and usually the working class takes the highest toll. Becoming independent from the international market would be a good fix, but a very ambitious goal.

Switching from gas vehicles to electric vehicles saves money for consumers, is a major pivotal step away from dependency on Russian or Middle Eastern oil and allows a fundamental aspect of independent economies to be self determined, stable and controlled within their own countries.


r/PoliticalDebate • • 46m ago

A fair flat tax?

• Upvotes

I know that people on "the right" have at various times proposed a flat tax. They typically want a carve out for dividend income with the claim that it is "double taxation." I actually agree with them but I say that money that a corporation pays out in dividends should be taxed at the receiver & the corporation should be allowed to deduct that as an expense (moneys paid out, just like salaries).

Consider this version of a flat tax & tell me what you think:

Implement a flat tax that covers ALL income, no exemptions! 13% should be more than adequate. If you implement it with a standard exemption for all adults (perhaps $20k ea.) & smaller, gradually reduced exemptions for the first 4 children ($5k, $4k, $3k, $2k ?) then the poorest working people would be protected from burdensome taxes while the wealthy & the corporations would pay closer to their fair share.

GDP is $32.56 Trillion. Adult population is ~270 million, 72 million minors. Families with children average 2 children (36 million families of 4). That gives a rough exemption amount of $5.4 trillion for childless families & $1,764 trillion for families with children for a rounded total of $7.164 trillion exempt & $25.396 trillion as the basis for income taxation.

The 2025 federal budget was $7 trillion with revenue of $5.26 Trillion of which $3.11 trillion was derived from personal & business income taxes. To produce the same revenue from income taxes would require a rate of ~12.24%. 13% ($3.3 trillion/yr) should allow us to actually start paying down the debt

A family of 4 making $50k/yr would pay $130/yr, making $100k would pay $6,630. I'm married &(semi) retired; I made $164k last year & would pay almost the same $17k under the flat tax that I paid under the current system. The difference would be made up by the wealthiest people & corporations who have benefited the most from our system & paid the least & are also the least needy.

While just considering equal government revenue without consideration of how the money is spent, do you think that this taxation plan is more fair?


r/PoliticalDebate • • 2h ago

Discussion The Trouble With Politics

0 Upvotes

The Trouble With Politics 

We have reached a point where politics has become so volatile, so divisive, that we are threatening the stability of this great nation, even society itself. If I asked for your thoughts, your opinions, regarding politicians, what comes to mind? It's fair to say that flattering or complimentary words can be hard to come by, even for those who represent a party you align with. The “other party,” well, there the words tend to get downright nasty. For some, political discussions bring out the worst in us. Our words, our actions, would be unacceptable, even by our own standards, in any other situation. How did we get here? Of greater concern, do you see it getting better or worse? 

The biggest problem with politics today is the politicians. More specifically, their actions or statements, which are often a result of the environment in which they are allowed to function. Special interests, personal needs, party ideology, backroom deals, and even greed or other unsavory human attributes can routinely influence their choices, their votes. Decisions that, at times, represent a betrayal of previous commitments, run counter to their public statements, or fail to put forth the interests of the people they represent. While the lack of political civility is currently being pushed to a breaking point, these core issues are nothing new. Hindsight is 20/20, and history speaks volumes here. Politicians have struggled to truly, honestly represent the people since the beginning of time. 

So, how do we fix this? Can it be fixed? How do we ensure that a government official conducts themselves with honesty and integrity? Sometimes complex issues have a very simple solution. They need to tell the truth, always tell the truth. To their colleagues, the press, and their constituents. Okay, on its face, such a concept sounds laughable, impossible. Elected and appointed officials are public servants; they work for the people. So, how is it that they are allowed to function as if they are working for a private company? To do the people's business in private, behind closed doors? Someone please explain to me how their secrecy benefits me. How do I know the best decisions are being made? Why were they made? How do I know these decisions truly represent the needs of the public? 

The solution is to demand full and complete transparency. There are already requirements to preserve documents, emails, and texts. Yet we have left a loophole as large as the universe itself: the ability to have an undocumented conversation. And it is here that the problem lies. It needs to stop. Secrecy breeds corruption. Any official conducting the people's business should be required to document, record, and have transcribed any and all conversations related to official business. We need the Transparency Act.

I would expect tremendous pushback from, well, everybody who would be required to comply with having to provide such transparency. A list of problematic scenarios would certainly emerge. Discussions are confidential, a constituent's personal information, matters of national security, political strategy, etc., etc. All of which are easily addressed. Almost no situation should exist where documentation is circumvented. It is simply governed by who gets access and when. Should party affiliates be conducting a ten-year strategy session? It's still recorded, becoming public in ten years. But only that content should be protected. You can't jam an unrelated discussion in there and bury it for ten years. The only remaining objection is cost. We are not only talking about preserving the integrity of what makes this country so great, democracy, but improving upon it. Should anyone choose to take a stand that our democracy isn't worth it, do so at your own peril. 

It's time that those in the public sector take responsibility and are held accountable for their statements or their silence, missteps, and policy failures. The ability to speak privately, off the record to strategize, allows one to create a narrative or spin something that otherwise reflects poorly on a party or an individual, for an official to pressure or coerce, to provide disinformation or suggestive half-truths, to intentionally obstruct or undermine an opponent or party. For conversations they would not want the public to hear, would cause embarrassment or shame, exposure is the perfect disinfectant. Lying won't be impossible. But to do so, either they will find themselves alone on an island, needing to break the law by having undocumented conversations or waiting for the public disclosure that shows they lied. This is a policy that needs to be thorough and have teeth. Intentionally circumventing the documentation of a conversation should be criminal. 

I do not wish to focus on an individual party, but I would like to reference two examples. While there was ample evidence to convict Rod Blagojevich of corruption, things get a lot easier, showing intent, if one chooses to evade the requirement to record their calls. More recently, there have been controversies surrounding the Lincoln Memorial Reflecting Pool. With full transparency, there would likely be no controversy. All conversations are documented. Everything is known. 

The true value in transparency is that it becomes a deterrent. Who is stupid enough to roll through a stop sign when a police officer is sitting at the intersection? We can produce an endless list of true, historical examples where transparency could have produced a different outcome. In many cases, issues would have ceased to occur in the first place. The cost of disclosure would simply be too steep. 

Think of how this would transform government. Federal, state, local, down to the city council and the school board, secrecy by those who represent us should be unacceptable. We need to demand honesty, integrity and accountability. We need to demand actions that are always in the best interests of our communities. The public is owed, deserves the truth.

D Prescott


r/PoliticalDebate • • 2h ago

Question How Have Your Political Views Evolved Over Time?

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1 Upvotes

r/PoliticalDebate • • 4h ago

Discussion How much of America’s “broken democracy” is just rich people getting what they paid for?

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0 Upvotes

r/PoliticalDebate • • 6h ago

Discussion How to reform social security and healthcare?

1 Upvotes

Should we move retirement policy towards a need based social security program (rather than blanket/age based) and mandates for company 401k options.

Then healthcare to allow international drugs on the market, insurance traded across states, reform cert of need laws, and do some combination of opening an immigrant pathway for doctors and having med school after high school to combat the doctor shortage.

Any other ones?

I know this is vague and a lot more needs to be done but any other ideas or directions?

To bring down costs.


r/PoliticalDebate • • 22h ago

Discussion Rent to Own social housing program, a full breakdown.

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3 Upvotes

r/PoliticalDebate • • 1d ago

Discussion Should drugs be decriminalized?

8 Upvotes

In my opinion the answer is an obvious yes- the majority of drug deaths are not due to the drugs themselves, but rather the fact that they are criminalized in the first place. Drug overdose deaths (and overdoses in general) are overwhelmingly caused by the adulteration of drugs with substances such as fentanyl. Decriminalizing drugs and allowing the distribution of safe supply drugs (that is, drugs that have been tested and confirmed to be pure) would drastically reduce (and possibly even eliminate) overdose deaths. For an example of the kind of effect legalizing safe supply could have, the Drug Users Liberation Front in Vancouver distributed over 3000 boxes of tested drugs to users, and not only did those drugs not lead to any deaths, they did not cause a single overdose.


r/PoliticalDebate • • 4h ago

Discussion Democrats do not have the moral high ground when it comes to ICE.

0 Upvotes

The Mayor of New York City tweeted this:

https://x.com/NYCMayor/status/2111042643891253729

This is who Democrats are defending. Oscar Belgal is a career felon and his 5 year old son will be stealing cars by the time he is 12. If Oscar Belgal was an American Democrats would be demanding he be separated from his son and placed into Child Protective Services. Instead Democrats say ICE is in the wrong for trying to deport his ass. I don’t understand your weird hatred for Law Enforcement. Your morons for wanting this scumbag to stay in America. Sorry but I don’t fell bad for him or his son. His son is just watching daddy commit crime after crime and will likely be stealing cars by the age of 10 or 12. Because this is normal to him.

Your compassion is dangerous. These types of people put everyone in danger. This is a learned behavior and Democrats refuse to accept that.

Writing
Oscar Belgal: Reported Criminal History and Allegations
Here is a summary of the publicly reported criminal history of Oscar Belgal, who was involved in the October 2026 incident with an ICE agent in Marble Hill, NYC.
Reported criminal history:
2023 — Grand larceny: Reportedly arrested for robbery and later pleaded guilty to fourth-degree grand larceny, a felony under New York law.

April 2025 — Sentencing: Reportedly sentenced to five years of probation.

August 2025 — Drug case: Reportedly arrested in a case involving the alleged criminal sale of cocaine and fentanyl. Reports described this case as pending, with a not-guilty plea reported.

Other reported allegations:
Gang affiliation: Federal officials have alleged links to the Trinitarios gang. An allegation is not proof of criminal conduct.

September 2026: DHS officials reportedly said Belgal had evaded officers during an attempted arrest.

October 2026 ICE shooting: DHS alleged that Belgal struck two government vehicles and accelerated toward officers. The government's account of the encounter has been disputed by his attorneys.

Sources for further verification:
New York State Unified Court System: https://iapps.courts.state.ny.us/webcivil/FCASMain

New York City Criminal Court: https://ww2.nycourts.gov/courts/nyc/criminal/index.shtml

Important: This is a summary of reported information, not an official or exhaustive rap sheet. Convictions must be distinguished from pending charges and unproven allegations. Consult the underlying court records and reliable reporting to verify the details.


r/PoliticalDebate • • 23h ago

Question 2nd amendment

1 Upvotes

Just curious of other opinions. Do we think the fact that Americans being heavily armed acts as a deterrent of foreign invaders, or is it more that geographically we are protected and it doesn’t make much of a difference?


r/PoliticalDebate • • 1d ago

Should the executive branch have control of Law Enforcement?

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0 Upvotes

r/PoliticalDebate • • 2d ago

Question Republicans are the party of endless war and high gas prices.

15 Upvotes

It should be obvious by now that the Republicans don't have a plan for the Iran war except to bomb, bomb, and bomb some more. And since gas prices are tied to Trump's War, prices won't be coming down as long as the Republicans control the government.

Who's going to end this war?


r/PoliticalDebate • • 1d ago

Debate The bodies haven’t even been buried yet and Democrats are already demanding that my 2nd Amendment rights be taken away.

0 Upvotes

https://x.com/SenAdamSchiff/status/2111105476628816119

>A teenager used a gun to murder innocent children.An educator died in a job that should not be life threatening.And yet the GOP majority will again resist any meaningful effort to stop the next school shooting.This is the reality of the current Congress. And it’s heartbreaking.

Likè fucking clockwork. It hasn’t even been 24 hours and you guys are already blaming Republicans who have 0 power in Oregon. Your Gun Control Laws did nothing to stop a Criminal. Locked doors did nothing to stop him. You know what did stop him? A armed citizen with a gun. But of course Democrats wont acknowledge that in their headlines. Because it defeats the narrative you want to paint.

Politicians seem to understand the answer. After all they give themselves armed security. For Congress they get Capital Police. For the President they get the Secret Service. All people with guns. But for some reason Democrats refuse to acknowledge that having Gun Free Signs doesn’t stop evil people with evil intent.

Your immediate reaction is just to ban everything and punish good LAW abiding citizens likè the armed citizen who has a CC permit. Can’t imagine how annoying that was to go get in leftist Oregon.


r/PoliticalDebate • • 1d ago

Political Philosophy Ethics, Politics, Punishments, and the Death Penalty

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1 Upvotes

r/PoliticalDebate • • 1d ago

Discussion Why is it that every time a tragedy happens Democrats immediately resort to taking away my 2nd Amendment rights?

0 Upvotes

A armed citizen stopped the School Shooter. Your locked doors didn’t shit. We need to stop trying to take away our 2nd Amendment rights because we have criminals in our society.

The police didn’t stop him a ARMED citizen did.

We need to stop making Schools soft targets.

Politicians give themselves armed security but not our fucking kids.

We give Banks armed security but not our fucking kids.

We give Airports armed security but not our fucking kids.

Every major institution has armed security but not our fucking kids.

Make it make sense.


r/PoliticalDebate • • 1d ago

Debate There's no valid reason whatsoever for the government to issue documents with "gender identity" info rather than biological sex.

0 Upvotes

Why should a passport or id have something as vague as "gender" rather than sex? Categorizing people around sex makes sense, it's as simple as that.


r/PoliticalDebate • • 1d ago

Debate Capitalism will be a terrible form of government if ai is a massive part of the economy.

0 Upvotes

I am mainly saying in the case that in the next 5-10 years we get a ai agent that takes over a significant amount of jobs. There is no way that capitalism in its current form such as what the United States has can exist.

L


r/PoliticalDebate • • 2d ago

Discussion The rise of the far-right in Europe

8 Upvotes

We’ve had enough discussions about American politics, let’s shift the focus and check-in on the affairs of Europe for a second.

The vibe I get is that there is a tacit acknowledgment of the increase in right-wing activity across Europe (Vox, NR, Fdl, AfD), but also an optimistic denial that Europe is anywhere as bad as the US.

My questions to Europeans:

- Do you think your government is adequately responding to economic issues, immigration, and/or national/cultural identity?
- Is there resentment towards the status quo and perceived government inefficiency?
- Does criticism against centrist/liberal politics also often criticize Ukraine?
- Do you think the centrist/liberal factions of your government are trying to be proactive, or are they more interested in maintaining the status quo?
- Do young adults (18-25) have good job prospects? In particular, how are the prospects for fresh university graduates?

Thanks.


r/PoliticalDebate • • 2d ago

Political Theory The Majority of Political Discourse is Perverted by Popular Misunderstandings on the Realities of States, Markets, and Democracy (and the Relationships Between Them); and What to Do About It.

4 Upvotes

Non-Market Coordination of Labour, Production, Distribution, and Exchange Necessarily Precedes, and is Continuously Required, to Sustain the Modern Market Economy:

The foundational premise is that, before you can have a modern market economy - the kind of impersonal, price-clearing trade at scale that Adam Smith described in The Wealth of Nations (and which is virtually synonymous with the modern nation-state) - you require the formal institutions that enforce contracts, protect property rights, and underwrite a stable medium of exchange. [1, 2]

However, to have such formal institutions, you first require people who will perform those roles and conduct that work - alongside a means of directing and coordinating both the people and their labour.

And this is what establishes the logical necessity of pre-market logic to coordinate and direct labour and production before the market can ever attempt to do so. For anyone to have time spare (from the necessity of subsistence farming) to be able to dedicate any of it towards staffing those institutions, society must already be producing an agricultural and material surplus - which in turn requires an existing division and specialisation of labour. Because society needs a division of labour just to build the institutional foundations that make a market possible in the first place, the market itself cannot be what coordinates that initial division of labour.  [3, 4]

Throughout history, human societies have solved this pre-market coordination problem in different ways. Within small tribal units, labour was coordinated through personal, kinship-based reciprocity; across early agricultural empires, it was coordinated through overt physical bondage in the forms of slavery, tribute, and feudalism. Yet while these non-market logics could organise production, none of them could birth a modern market economy. Kinship reciprocity collapses beyond small networks of personal trust, while slavery and feudalism immobilise workers through direct domination - stripping people of the autonomy required to become free consumers and flexible market participants. 

To generate a modern market economy, society required a different mechanism capable of scaling the reciprocal cooperation of the village across millions of strangers, without resorting to the physical bondage of feudalism or slavery.

And that mechanism was taxation - a form of legal coercion exercised by a sovereign authority who can mobilise labour, command resources, and ultimately create the demand for the very currency on which a modern market will run. 

And this requires the issuance of tax credits (otherwise known as money). The sovereign authority and currency issuer first began by imposing a tax obligation (of n taxes) on their citizens, and then created specific jobs that people could perform to acquire the tax credits necessary to satisfy their outstanding tax obligations. [5, 6, 7]

Of course, taxation did not begin as an enlightened or benevolent force. For centuries of early statecraft, taxation operated as a violently coercive instrument of extraction - not far removed from the slavery, imperial tribute, and feudalism it existed alongside - used primarily by monarchs and warlords to provision armies and enrich ruling elites. Yet unlike direct physical bondage, taxation contained a crucial structural difference: by demanding payment in _currency_ rather than owning the worker's body outright, it preserved a space for human autonomy. And as societies progressed and became more civilised, this fiscal mechanism began to be utilised in far more **amicably coercive** ways - directing resources not merely toward the crown's barracks, but toward the foundational institutions of civil society.

By issuing currency toward public provisioning and reclaiming it through taxation, the sovereign manufactures the **diffused, impersonal trust** required for large-scale specialisation to begin. It is through this fiscal architecture that a widespread societal web of mutual expectation is woven amongst strangers: the farmer can focus on his crops because he trusts that the soldier will protect his land; the soldier protects the land because can expect that he will be fed and sheltered at night; and the soldier can also trust that there are practicing nurses who will be there to tend to his wounds if he is to get injured. 

Rather than replacing the cooperative reciprocity of the village, sovereign taxation is the very mechanism that allows civil society to scale it to the level of a nation-state; because each has a tax obligation that they must fulfil to appease a superior physical power, and yet they are welcoming and amicable to such an arrangement because they can observe the results compared to the alternatives where no such tax obligation exists. 

In the modern day, this is not a particularly relatable story, because the causal chain has mostly become invisible, especially since we do not exactly have tax obligations levied against us _before_ we find work. Yet, to the best of our historical and empirical knowledge, this market-preceding logic of compulsory taxation and public provisioning remains a permanent prerequisite for price-clearing markets to emerge and endure. 

This is because, without the state continuously issuing currency, enforcing tax liabilities in that unit of account, and directing real resources toward non-market foundations (courts, schools, healthcare, and infrastructure), the private market would lose both the stable money it trades with and the social system of capable people it trades within - two foundations that market logic can never provide for itself.

Firstly, it would lose its money, because a price-signalling market cannot bootstrap its own universal unit of account. Left purely to market logic, any private commodity-money fluctuates in value like a speculative asset, and its acceptance in trade remains fragile. It is only through the non-market compulsion of taxation that a currency acquires a permanent, universal baseline of demand - allowing it to transcend its primary role as a tax credit and become a stable unit of account and medium of exchange for private trade.

Secondly, it would lose its people - because, ultimately, the market cannot build its own foundations because it cannot create its own participants. Unlike commodities, human beings are not produced in factories in response to price signals for profit. Price-clearing markets only respond to _effective demand_ - desires backed by existing purchasing power - in pursuit of short-term, capturable returns. Yet human beings enter the world with zero purchasing power, and require nearly two decades of continuous care and investment before they can ever enter the market to work or trade. Because meeting these existential, non-discretionary needs across an entire population is inherently unprofitable, citizens must first be raised, educated, kept healthy, protected, and socialised outside of market logic - by a web of families, communities, and public institutions.

The market uses productive, healthy, literate, and law-abiding citizens, but it does not manufacture them - ensuring that non-market coordination remains the permanent prerequisite for private trade.

And embracing these facts is the most productive thing that capitalism could ever do. Because, when a market economy forgets its own origin story, it begins to treat the social sphere as a parasitic burden - rather than a structural foundation.

Dissolving the Public–Private Dichotomy and the False Conflict Between the State and the Market:

Under the illusion that private wealth is entirely self-generating, it seeks to minimise taxation, starve public institutions, and subject healthcare, education, and justice to the short-term logic of profit. In doing so, the market begins to saw off the very branch it is sitting on - slowly eroding the health, literacy, and institutional trust of the workforce and consumers that it relies upon to function.

Conversely, when a society recognises that social coordination precedes the market, the false war between the public and private sectors dissolves. Funding teachers, nurses, courts, and infrastructure is no longer mischaracterised as a "drag" on the economy, or an act of charity paid for after the market has done its work. Instead, it is understood for what it truly is: the primary investment that makes private enterprise possible in the first place.

A business cannot innovate if its workforce is chronically ill or poorly educated; entrepreneurs cannot take risks if contracts are unenforceable or infrastructure is crumbling. And thus a flourishing market economy does not require a retreating state; it requires a competent sovereign that continuously replenishes the human, social, and institutional capital which private enterprise then has the privilege to utilise and draw upon.

So, once we understand that a sovereign currency issuer does not need to "extract" money from the private market in order to build society's foundations (because state provisioning and taxation are what create and anchor the currency in the first place), our entire economic outlook changes.

The central question of politics is no longer "How much public education, healthcare, and infrastructure can the private market afford to fund?" Instead, the question becomes: "How do we mobilise our real resources and labour to build the strongest possible human and institutional foundation for our market economy?"

The True Macroeconomic Circuit, and Reconceptualising the True State–Market Boundaries:

Once we ask the right question, the true macroeconomic circuit comes into view: first, the sovereign authority issues currency to fund the workers and enterprises that enable fruitful social reproduction. Next, a portion of each individual's newly earned currency is reclaimed to settle the tax obligation levied against them (which helps to anchor the demand for the currency, and thus its value). Finally, the surplus financial wealth that remains in the hands of households and firms becomes the very purchasing power that funds the private market economy.

This reveals that the sovereign’s net spending is the private sector’s net financial surplus. So, when a government obsessively pursues austerity - slashing public provisioning while maintaining high tax extraction - it does not merely starve schools, hospitals, and courts of the financial resources necessary for adequate operation; it actively drains the private market of the net financial assets required to buy goods and services too. Deprived of state-issued purchasing power, households and businesses are forced to turn to commercial banks where they must take on ever-increasing loads of private debt just to keep the market turning. Starving the social foundation does not make the private market leaner or stronger - it instead renders it fragile, indebted, and prone to crisis.

Does this mean a sovereign state can simply issue limitless currency without consequence? Not at all - and this is where taxation asserts its secondary modern role. While a currency-issuing state never faces a financial constraint, society always faces real resource constraints - as there are only so many trained nurses, skilled builders, megawatts of energy, and tonnes of steel available at any given moment - just as a nation's capacity to produce and sell exports will affect its capability to import critical resources without also importing inflation.

If combined public and private spending exceeds what our workers and enterprises can physically produce, the result is inflation. Modern taxation, across income, corporate profits, unearned asset appreciation, and consumption, is what drains excess purchasing power when competing demands outstrip finite real resources and ensuring those resources can be prioritised for more systemically vital non-discretionary and foundational needs, instead of being used to bid up prices to satisfy discretionary desires.

Understanding this sequence gives us a clear blueprint for where the boundary between state and market belongs. We should never subject either the prerequisites of market participation or finite, non-reproducible bottlenecks to the logic of for-profit ownership. Healthcare, education, basic security, and justice are not ordinary commodities to be rationed by price; nor can spatial land, natural resources, and natural monopoly infrastructure (like water, energy, and transport grids) be privately monopolised. Because these are the foundational inputs that allow citizens to enter the market as equals, allowing private gatekeepers to own them only breeds predatory market power pricing - making social reproduction unaffordable and productive enterprise artificially costly.

Conversely, when society guarantees its social foundations publicly and holds its physical bottlenecks in common trust, the private market is finally freed to do what it actually does best: generating useful price signals where competition is possible, demonstrating financial discipline, improving reproducible production, rewarding genuine innovation, and discovering operational efficiencies.

This is why the public and private sectors can work so well together when coordinated competently - provided the boundary between them respects the limits of contractibility. 

Whilst non-reproducible bottlenecks and foundational goods cannot legitimately be owned for profit, private enterprise can still operate under public charter where the profit motive genuinely aligns with the public interest. Crucially, this mechanism must be restricted to commodified, physically verifiable deliverables - such as laying fiber networks, constructing transit lines, or installing renewable energy grids. For these discrete technical assets, the state can deploy reverse auctions, inviting private firms to compete within strict engineering and access mandates. In these domains, market discipline excels: profit is derived from engineering ingenuity, logistical innovation, and material efficiency - allowing the public to reap cost savings on outputs whose quality can be objectively measured before payment is cleared.

Conversely, we must strictly exclude high-touch, relational commons, such as healthcare, elder care, child welfare, primary education, and custodial justice, from competitive tendering. Because human care, compassion, and dignity cannot be fully codified in a procurement contract, subjecting these services to the lowest bidder predictably incentivizes "quality shading": cutting corners on unmeasurable human labor, suppressing front-line wages, and gaming administrative metrics to extract a margin. By deploying market competition solely where outcomes are physically deterministic and keeping our high-touch social reproduction under direct public administration, society harnesses private technical efficiency without compromising the human foundations that make the market possible in the first place.

The Real Failures Are Thus Political:

Of course, recognising the indispensable role of the sovereign brings us face-to-face with an uncomfortable reality: it reveals the state as an extraordinarily powerful institution, or at least, an institution capable of extraordinary utility - if only it makes the right decisions. Too often at present, it does not. The reason our foundations feel neglected is rarely a lack of sovereign capacity, but a failure of political direction, because modern electoral dynamics (driven by short-term campaign cycles, sectarian partisanship, regulatory and oligarchic capture, cronyism, and the pursuit of popular support over long-term outcomes) systemically misalign the incentives of (often corrupt and/or incompetent) governments with the genuine interests of their citizens.

It is obvious though that we cannot simply abolish the need for social coordination - so we have no other choice but to perfect it. The next great frontier of political economy is not privatising the state, but pioneering democratic innovations; redesigning our political and administrative institutions so that the government becomes genuinely aligned, competent, effective, efficient, accountable, and autonomous.

So, Here's What I Believe That We Must Do About It: Constitutional Reform to Democratise the Sovereign and Finance:

In this section, I will attempt to separate between the broad diagnosis of ‘what’ I believe needs to change, and my more personal opinions and conjectures on the alternative mechanisms which could underpin more specifically ‘how’ we might practically engineer those outcomes. 

Even if one disagrees with the exact suggestions below, I hope to bring awareness and spark debate around the existence of alternative frameworks, concepts, ideas, systems, and mechanisms which could be adopted. 

Firstly, at a structural level, we must cure electoral short-termism, partisan gridlock, and the polarising incentives that make even broadly popular, long-term investments so difficult to implement - transforming the roles of our elected officials from ideological combatants into executive administrators and diplomatic representatives of the state.

My favoured mechanism to achieve this, would be to transfer much of the core agenda-setting and policymaking authority to permanently institutionalised, sortition-based bodies of citizens, who would be equipped with genuine sovereign power. By entrusting democratic deliberation to a stratified, representative sample of the public itself, elected politicians are no longer tasked with warring over ideology, but are instead employed to administer the citizenry's instructions at home and represent the state on the world stage.

However, because ordinary citizens drawn by lottery are not domain specialists, a sortition assembly is vulnerable to manipulation by self-interested and/or biased civil servants and facilitators who draft briefing papers and select the expert witnesses in ways that quietly steer the outcome towards their desires. And so, to ensure the assembly remains genuinely sovereign, its epistemic architecture must be built on three constitutional safeguards: adversarial briefing models (where competing analytical teams cross-examine each other’s assumptions in plain language - rather than relying on a single "consensus" narrative); autonomous investigative power (equipping citizens with an independent budget to commission outside research, alongside legal subpoena powers to compel raw departmental data and summon frontline workers or whistleblowers); and staggered, overlapping tenures paired with a dedicated citizen oversight chamber - ensuring that institutional memory is passed directly between cohorts so a permanent bureaucracy can never simply outwait and outmanoeuvre a rotating public. 

Secondly, I believe it is important to realign electoral incentives, so that elections select unifying, competent administrators - rather than divisive and popularist politicians who encourage the electorate to turn against each other. 

This goes hand-in-hand with the first recommendation of implementing sovereign sortition-based bodies of citizens, because such bodies would already inherently guarantee true proportional representation of the electorate within government, which would allow us to shift the focus of elections towards the competence and broadest cross-societal appeal of a single coherent party, to encourage politics to be about consensus-building and constructivism rather than the polarising partisanism that often results from plurality voting (such as FPTP) and the incoherent, fragmented and tribal sectarianism that often results from the ‘proportional representation’ promised by ordinal methods (like STV or IRV). 

My preferred voting method would be a simple cardinal method, like STAR voting.

Thirdly, we must sever the link between private wealth and political power so that these administrative and diplomatic offices remain completely free from oligarchic capture.

Practically, this can be achieved by banning all corporate, trade association, and foreign political donations entirely, capping individual private donations at a modest egalitarian ceiling, and publicly funding elections through egalitarian mechanisms such as "democracy vouchers".

Fourthly, we must permanently police the boundary between the commons and the market, ensuring that neither the human prerequisites of market participation nor finite, non-reproducible bottlenecks are enclosed for private rent extraction.

To make this operational, our economic governance must look beyond narrow antitrust enforcement toward a comprehensive constitutional settlement: legally ring-fencing foundational public goods from privatisation, enforcing strict public-utility and common-carrier mandates on natural monopolies, and using land-value and resource taxes to reclaim the unearned economic rent extracted from finite land and natural assets.

And finally, at a structural level, we must end the state’s institutionally self-imposed financial capture - stopping commercial banks from pumping credit into unproductive asset speculation, while preventing private bond markets and offshore currency speculators from holding public provisioning hostage.

As a practical overhaul of our banking, fiscal, and monetary architecture, a competent sovereign should use targeted credit guidance to steer domestic bank lending away from land and monopoly bottlenecks toward real innovation and productive enterprise; directly coordinate its central bank and treasury (so that funding our social foundations is never subjected to the veto of financial markets); and deploy well-targeted capital flow management whenever necessary in the public interest - insulating the nation's currency from predatory speculation and destabilising capital flight to safeguard its foreign exchange health and domestic purchasing power.

In the end, a thriving market economy depends on a thriving social foundation - and that foundation depends on a democracy worthy of the power it wields. We should not demand for a smaller and weaker state; what we should demand is a smarter constitution to democratically steer an adequately and proportionately sized one. 


r/PoliticalDebate • • 1d ago

Other Why do we have child representatives ("lawyers for children")?

0 Upvotes

Speaking as a teenager in highschool, why do we have grown ups speaking for us. In my very honest opinion I don't even think we even need them

I get it adults think we aren't "developed" enough or "don't understand" but we very much do and adults would be very surprised at how much we actually know life wise.

we don't need adults speaking for us. If I could I would protest about this too. We don't need lawyers for "lawsuits" for kids, for some apps yes I agree, but some are kinda utterly stupid and parents lying to lawyers just to get the money from the lawsuit. Can we kids get a chance to have a voice instead of an adult who will only spill lies just to get what they want And silence us teenagers and kids?.

I honestly think the government should put up a system where the judge asks the kids what the app does or how it affects them in life instead of a lawyer because please we do not need one we have our own voice for a reason it's called freedom of flipping speech and adults are not allowing us kids to have that.

If someone could protest or even kids themselves and like me could protest about this please do, we all have a voice we just never use it and we are ALLOWED to use our voice as well no matter how young we are.


r/PoliticalDebate • • 2d ago

Discussion We Rule Ourselves By Using Our Rights

0 Upvotes

This is a simple but very important principle. If we don't understand it, we can't understand democracy.

To rule is to exercise authority or control. The only way we have authority or control, over our lives is to use our rights. Without our rights we have no agency and legally have to obey the government. Legally using our rights, allows the people to rule themselves and tell government to "kick rocks".

If we don't understand that, authoritarians can limit or minimize the rights we can use. They'll tell us juries can't nullify bad law or we can't demand grand jury investigations or make citizens arrests of ICE agents or participate in Article V conventions... or however you want to legally use your rights to influence the due process of the country. They'll say that's not democracy.

This allows authority (in this case the 1% and politicians) to limit US to just voting rights. They've conditioned US into thinking just voting is democracy AND they've figured ways to manipulate our voting rights.

Exercising and growing our rights is critical to strong democracy