r/anime • u/ZapsZzz https://myanimelist.net/profile/ZapszzZ • 19d ago
Rewatch Hyouka 14th Year Rewatch Overall Discussion
Fan art of the day
(Unless specifically mentioned, count on this being from the old collection of Mery)
< Last Episode Index Shoushimin Rewatch When?
Interest thread Announcement Thread
Welcome to the Final Discussion post of the Hyouka rewatch!
For the interest of any first timer visiting this thread now or later, please use spoiler tags for events not yet played out by this episode.
Spoiler tag format:
[Hyouka spoiler]>!This is most curious!!< (Make sure no spaces between the exclaimation mark and the first letter of the sentence of the spoiler text)
e.g. [Hyouka spoiler]Chitanda's eyes are mesmerising!
Questions for the final discussion
- Of the main cast, who is the most memorable character and why
- Of the side cast (include anyone outside of the main), who is most memorable and why
- If you were asked to sum up this show in 1 sentence, what would you say
- What would be the main category you classify this show as - Mystery? Romance? Drama? SoL? etc
- How would you rate this show as the category you slot this into, out of 10? Would you rate it differently if it's classified into a different category?
- How would you rank the arcs? Include the last 5 episode as an arc if you like - or not.
- What's the biggest problem you have about this show (other than not having season 2)?
- Which mystery impressed you most - whether it's the reveal, the setup/complexity, or if you could solve it before the reveal, etc. Anything goes.
- What other anime (or other shows in any medium) would you compare Hyouka most closely with?
- How much do you think the production value and directional flairs of KyoAni influenced your enjoyment/appreciation of the show? Pick another studio as a hypothetical and say how you think the adaptation would differ and how would you like that by comparison.
Bonus one for anyone game enough - how would you compare "The Classics Club" (Koten-bu) with "How to be Ordinary" (Shoushimin) from the same author?
Remark from yesterday's QoTD answers
- Other than some reserving their final words for today, by my count most consider the finale a reasonable place to stop at in terms of the relationship progression - writing that they would go further is not reasonable expectation for who they are and where they are in life.
- There's a bit of doubt here but everyone agreed Oreki would go very far for Chitanda, no question there. Those few who had doubts were cast on whether he can fit the "business man" role - but that is not the only way to serve that purpose anyway.
We also unintentionally became the last rewatch able to say "available on Crunchyroll" - since on the last day of the show it got taken down from that steaming pile of shite streaming site!
Pinned Content
High quality content to complement this rewatch:
I would love it if you guys watching (first timers and rewatchers alike) would watch this youtube breakdown of Hyouka called "A Rose-Colored Dissection" It is really well done, and will give you insight on the series even more. It is mostly spoiler free if you watch them episode by episode (for some vids) and arc by arc (for some vids).
\*Added*\** An earlier years rewatch final post that verbalised a lot better what I wanted to say about the final "denouement arc".
Acknowledgements
While everyone engaged with this rewatch - including those who does comment and those who are just happy to lurk - has my thanks for spending your time on this show that I adore, a few I believe warrants some special thanks here. I'm not using the full user name tagging format as only the first 3 tags get processed.
- our certain secret squirrel who is absolutely passionate about this show - far more than I do - who hosted the last Hyouka rewatch 4 years ago but can't host this in this sub anymore but "encouraged" me to host this rewatch.
- Slntreaper who spent hours to bring in novel source to compare and contrast, including a lot of great insights as well
- Holofan4life who provides round the clock engagement with other commenters
- Fools_Requiem for the table of counting kininarimasu's and bonus materials
- Eth_02 for always showing appreciation of the fan arts I picked
- The rewatchers club of Malipit and MishouMai, who gave some good insights from having had time to digest and consider the show for some time.
- The first timers club of Second_Cour, dontoff, bobbyjean_, Shimmering-Sky, and Nickthenuker who gave great first timer reactions and help rewatchers reconnect some points that may have been glossed over before. This often is the "main ingredient" for Rewatchers on Rewatch threads :) Although this show is not quite PMMM...
Advanced apologies for lateness
Because of how much I still want to say but haven't yet put pen to paper, my own comment will likely to be late. So please do check back the thread later on possibly "the next day" in the US time zone!
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u/Malipit 19d ago
First of all, a huge thank for our host u/ZapsZzz for giving me a reason to rewatch Hyouka.
Now onto my overall thoughs :
I like to rate the animes I watch according to tiers. S+ being the absolute best. D- being the crappiest of crap
If anything, Hyouka anime adaptation nails how Oreki view the world. This is an anime without great stakes, without intense drama, without big twist changing the whole setting in just an episode.
All we have is a group of teenagers hanging out at school with the occasional mystery popping up once in every two months.
There is not much energy consumed to follow the Classic Literature Club daily life.
And it works.
Wether you see it as a slice-of-life with mystery elements or a mystery show that have a slice-of-life pace, Hyouka episodes are compelling to follow.
Hyouka manages to find the right balance between those two aspects to gives us a story relaxing and intriguing at the same time. And KyoAni masterful animation and direction managed to sublimate it.
A pity this isn't likely to have an animated continuation as the potential is right here for more.
[Final Rank]S- Has there was a second season to continue the story, I could arguably rate Hyuka with a S
Overall questions
Of the main cast, who is the most memorable character and why
Eru Chitanda. I've yet to see a character so intrigued by life.
Of the side cast (include anyone outside of the main), who is most memorable and why
She appears phisycally like 3 times in the whole show, and yet she have a great influence on the story.
If you were asked to sum up this show in 1 sentence, what would you say
''Local teenager is dragged around to solves mysteries by his soulmate''
What would be the main category you classify this show as - Mystery? Romance? Drama? SoL? etc
Slice-of-life meet Mystery
How would you rate this show as the category you slot this into, out of 10? Would you rate it differently if it's classified into a different category?
Already done. And I wouldn't rate it differently since I will never slot it into another category.
How would you rank the arcs? Include the last 5 episode as an arc if you like - or not.
Kanya Festival > Unfinished film > Hyouka anthology > last stretch
What's the biggest problem you have about this show (other than not having season 2)?
Why don't we have Satoshi and Mayaka phonecall ?
Which mystery impressed you most - whether it's the reveal, the setup/complexity, or if you could solve it before the reveal, etc. Anything goes.
Oreki own solution to the unfinished film is what stick to me the most.
What other anime (or other shows in any medium) would you compare Hyouka most closely with?
First thing that comes up in mind is Kaguya Sama : Love is War because of the unconventional love story and the smart protagonists
How much do you think the production value and directional flairs of KyoAni influenced your enjoyment/appreciation of the show? Pick another studio as a hypothetical and say how you think the adaptation would differ and how would you like that by comparison.
KyoAni nailed the tone of the story and the animation was beautiful. As for another studio to do a remake of the show, it's clearly a joke answer but I would say Trigger. Just to have their over the top/flashy effects illustrate how Chitanda mesmerize Oreki in the first episode.
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u/ZapsZzz https://myanimelist.net/profile/ZapszzZ 18d ago
Thanks for diligently answering my daily questions :) it's great to hear from fellow rewatchers for more in depth insights from having had time to digest the show.
Love is war is at least comparable in the "main ship is clearly there but not ready to sail just yet" category.
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u/Nickthenuker https://anilist.co/user/Nickthenuker 19d ago
Questions:
Probably Oreki.
Hard to say.
Everyday mysteries.
Mystery SoL?
8? As a romance it's maybe 6 or 7 at best, didn't really do too much, as a drama probably same as romance, not too much dramatic going on.
The school festival was quite enjoyable.
It doesn't always give all the information required to solve the mysteries I don't think?
The reveal on what was going on in the background of the school festival.
Shoshimin. For perhaps obvious reasons.
Oh definitely, KyoAni always does good work.
Bonus: Ah. There it is. I think I preferred Shoshimin more tbh. It's about the same length, with this being a 2 cour season and Shoshimin having 2 seasons, but it felt like more stuff happened in that.
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u/ZapsZzz https://myanimelist.net/profile/ZapszzZ 18d ago
Hey there, glad you made the overall discussion on the same day - that catch up run would have been quite something! I did read all your comments even if they were late though!
It'd be great if you are volunteering to host a follow on Shoushimin rewatch to preach to us how great it is ;)
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u/Nickthenuker https://anilist.co/user/Nickthenuker 18d ago
God no I don't think I'd be able to commit to hosting a rewatch. I miss 3 episodes of this regularly and then binge them all on the same day, no way I'd be able to post a discussion thread at a regular hour every day for most of a month lol.
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u/Holofan4life 19d ago
Let's talk about the show as a whole, shall we?
To start, let’s look at all the predictions I made in episode 5.
Eru is not human and the reason she's so curious is because she's an alien/otherworldly being.
The Classic Lit Club will use the anthology to try and clear Jun Sekitani's name
Tomoe will show up in person at some point
Jun Sekitani is alive and will show up at some point
Hotaro will embrace being more outgoing and will learn the dangers of energy conservation and that it's okay to be selective with that sorta thing
Hotaro and Eru will end up together by the end of the series
Whelp, I got none of them right :P
I think the show is at its best when it portrays how brutal life can be. Hyouka is like a cross between FLCL and Cowboy Bebop if it was less cynical and more grounded. I think some of the lesser episodes were the standalone episodes, but I also like quite a few of them like the situation episode and the Valentines Day episode. This arc was at its best when it does arcs because it allowed us to have a focus of sorts. As such, it doesn't force us to rush into things. It was interesting hoe as the series went on, the mystery aspect was kinda downplayed. It was like it existed in the early episodes as a means to flesh out the characters and develop their personalities. And when the personalities were fully developed, they could wane off all the mystery stuff.
Best episode was episode 5, favorite character was Mayaka, best arc was the cultural festival, and I thought the best stretch of the show was the cultural festival. That was when the characters were fully developed but we still relied om the element of surprise in a non passive manner.
I'd give this show an 8.5 out of 10. This is a show that is very consistent and only has like 3 episodes I would consider as being meh, but even they weren't that bad. I know I've compared Haruhi a lot to this show, but I think what this show does better than Haruhi is that there's less downtime. The episodes of Hyouka normally has at least one moment where you reflect on life and how you personally go about doing things. I think Haruhi has more rewatchability to it, but quality wise I really don't have anything to complain about Hyouka. I wish we had gotten one more arc, but that's more of a personal preference.
I joined this rewatch on a whim based off of a recommendation of someone I trust. And it actually worked out well because it was a nice palette cleanser from some of the other shows shows I've watched recently. The word that comes to mind when I think of Hyouka is refreshing. It is basic in terms of its plots, but it offers food for thought for almost all its outings. It's easily accessible, but also deep enough to dissect and analyze.
Hyouka I would put in the top 30 best anime I've ever seen. And now that I've seen it, I won't have to be curious of what a great show it is :Da
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u/Second_Cour 19d ago
It was interesting hoe
I wish you wouldn't call Chitanda a hoe!
I think the show is at its best when it portrays how brutal life can be.
What are some examples of brutal life, as shown in the anime?
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u/Holofan4life 18d ago
Damn autocorrect :P
Like feeling you are better at something than someone else but not wanting to tell them that to their face.
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u/Second_Cour 18d ago
That's brutal?
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u/Holofan4life 18d ago
Absolutely. It's brutal because communication could do a world of good but you don't want to hurt the others feelings.
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u/ZapsZzz https://myanimelist.net/profile/ZapszzZ 18d ago
Thanks for keeping the conversations going! A little unfortunate you didn't enjoy the last "arc" as much as I hoped for, but at least for the bulk of the show you enjoyed it. If you haven't seen Ground Control to Psychoelectric Girl though, you really should find some time to. It's another show that has some really good conversation dialogues. And there are aliens involved ;)
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u/Holofan4life 18d ago
I wish the last arc was more of an arc than it was. Like, I didn't think there was enough connective tissue to string things together.
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u/dontoff 19d ago
First Timer (Dub)
Man, what a fun ride.
Before getting into anything else, I want to be clear that watching Hyouka was a rewarding experience for me. I enjoyed it a lot. There were things that frustrated the fuck out of me, as anyone who read some of my episode posts probably knows, but I’m very glad I finally watched it.
More than anything, this adaptation feels like a labour of love. There’s so much care in how the characters move, how conversations are framed, when the music enters, and how an ordinary room changes depending on what someone is feeling. There are scenes from this show that I’m not going to forget. Even during episodes where the writing lost me, there was usually something in the presentation or the smaller interactions that I could appreciate.
I also have to say, I don’t think this show would be anywhere near as good without an S-tier studio adapting it. And this isn’t just any S-tier studio. It’s KyoAni, my favourite, which I think is on a level of its own. They contributed so much to what I enjoyed, and with a less accomplished adaptation, the weaker parts of the writing would’ve been much harder for me to sit through.
One detail from Futoshi Nishiya’s comments on the finale really fits what I loved about the adaptation. He talks about Oreki and Chitanda becoming more conscious of each other’s feelings in the latter half, and considering how gradually to soften Oreki’s expressions. You spend enough time watching these characters that a small change in how they look at each other becomes something you’re excited to see.
Hyouka also left me with plenty to think about throughout its run. That’s more than I can say for a lot of what I watch, and it’s why I wanted this review to be a little more personal.
Oreki and Chitanda
These two are the heart of the show for me. They were also the image I had of Hyouka long before watching it, partly because I’d heard so much about the supposed romance baiting. That was one of the things that kept me from starting it.
For me, teasing a relationship doesn’t automatically make something romance bait. First, the show has to actually encourage that expectation. Sometimes fans get attached to a pairing the story has barely suggested and then get pissed when it doesn’t happen. That obviously isn’t the situation here. Hyouka is very deliberately making us interested in these two together.
The more important question is whether their relationship develops naturally. Do things move when it makes sense for these particular people, given their personalities and circumstances? Or does the writing force them forward or hold them back to keep getting the reaction it wants?
For the most part, I was really impressed with how naturally Oreki and Chitanda developed.
Looking back, their relationship feels noticeably different from one part of the show to another. They get more comfortable, learn how to approach each other, start teasing, and become conscious of things they previously did without thinking. By the time Chitanda gets embarrassed about being close to him, that reaction means something because we’ve watched her invade his personal space so casually before.
I also appreciated that they both had something to learn from each other. Oreki’s scepticism sometimes catches things Chitanda’s optimism misses, while she gives him reasons to reconsider conclusions he’s been too quick to settle on. I liked seeing his grey outlook have value even as he became more willing to step outside it.
That part connected with me personally. I understand approaching social situations by asking whether the experience is worth the energy or potential trouble. Sometimes keeping to yourself is a deliberate choice based on what you’ve experienced. But I’ve also had people pull me into things I wouldn’t have chosen myself and ended up enjoying them. That doesn’t completely change your outlook overnight. It does give you reasons to question how much you might be ruling out beforehand.
Oreki’s gradual willingness to participate worked for me because he remained recognisably himself. He could still complain, get embarrassed, or look for the easiest way through something while clearly wanting to be there.
Neither he nor Chitanda strikes me as someone who would rush headfirst into a relationship, especially Oreki. There’s an all-or-nothing quality to how I read him. He’s still figuring himself out, what she means to him, and how he could fit into her world. She’s learning about him too.
That’s why I don’t agree that the finale’s fake-out was necessarily the wrong choice. Of course part of me wanted him to say it. In the moment, that would’ve been fantastic. But him seriously imagining a place beside her already tells us something, and saying it aloud would be a much bigger commitment.
I wanted the direct moment, but I didn’t think this was the right point for him to give it. The ending made their feelings and the possibility of a shared future clear enough for me.
There is one thing I still dislike, though: Chitanda’s explanation for not giving Oreki chocolate on Valentine’s Day.
That family custom felt far too convenient to me. We get the romantic implication without her having to follow through, and I can’t shake the feeling that it conveniently keeps their situation out of the way while the episode focuses on Satoshi and Mayaka.
Imagine a Valentine’s episode following all four of them, with two very different relationships reaching a difficult point on the same day. Something with the festival arc’s shifting perspectives. Man, I would’ve loved that.
I don’t think giving him chocolate would require an immediate confession or magically resolve their relationship. It could simply make them confront something they’d been circling around. The explanation used to avoid that remains a blemish for me, even though I liked their overall progression.
Satoshi and Mayaka were the disappointment
This was the bigger surprise, and it hurt how I felt about the show much more.
Satoshi’s relationship with Oreki was really good. His admiration, envy, and frustration made sense to me. Watching your friend casually do something you desperately want to be good at is an uncomfortable position to be in. You can care about them and still feel like shit about the comparison. I liked that the show let those feelings coexist.
The festival made me more invested in him. That’s part of why where we landed with Mayaka was so disappointing.
I already went into this at length in my Episode 21 post, so I won’t repeat the whole argument. I understood why Satoshi wanted to escape his old obsessive competitiveness. What didn’t convince me was the connection between accepting Mayaka’s feelings and reverting to that old self. Being deeply invested in a relationship is a different situation from dedicating yourself to things because you need to win.
I understood the rule he’d built for himself. I didn’t find the fear behind applying it to Mayaka convincing enough to carry all that avoidance, especially after such a long buildup.
And the problem wasn’t simply that he behaved like an asshole. His jealousy toward Oreki already showed that I could enjoy him having unpleasant feelings. Here, the explanation for hurting Mayaka again felt inadequate to me, and the offscreen phone conversation wasn’t the development I’d been waiting to see.
So does Hyouka contain romance edging? For me, yes, and this is where most of it comes from.
It feels like the writing wants to preserve their familiar dynamic. Them becoming a couple would change how these four interact, and I would’ve welcomed that. Satoshi could still struggle with himself while dating her. There would still be things to write about.
Seeing their familiar back-and-forth again in the finale left me feeling that we’d returned to much the same place. Whatever that phone call may have changed, I wanted more of that change onscreen.
I still value what the show did between Satoshi and Oreki. But the Mayaka situation left me disappointed in where we ended up with him, and knowing that’s where the buildup leads would affect a rewatch for me.
continued in replies ---->
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u/dontoff 19d ago
What the mysteries gave me
The mystery element was always going to have a harder time winning me over. It’s simply a genre I enjoy less consistently than others. Usually, I cared more about what a case revealed about the people involved than the solution itself.
The Sekitani Jun arc handled that really well. Understanding the events wasn’t enough. Understanding what those events meant to someone changed the whole story. That gave the mystery a reason to matter beyond the answer.
The film arc was comfortably the weakest for me. I could appreciate its ideas about pride, recognition, and misunderstanding someone’s intentions, but too much of the setup felt arranged to make Oreki fail. His oversights, the others being unavailable, and the lack of follow-through on asking Hongou kept pulling me out of it. Irisu also rarely felt convincing to me across that arc.
There being an explanation for those choices didn’t automatically make the execution work. KyoAni still gave me scenes I enjoyed watching, but the presentation couldn’t resolve my problems with the writing.
The festival was the strongest arc, especially once its final conversations brought everyone’s experiences together.
What stayed with me most was how expectations affect relationships. Satoshi, Kouchi, and Tanabe all struggle with someone else’s ability, but they respond differently. Admiration can make you want more from someone. It can also make being around them painful, particularly when they seem barely interested in something you work hard at.
I recognise that uncomfortable shift in myself depending on whether I’m around someone I see as more or less capable than me. The arc gave me a lot to think about there.
And expectations go far beyond talent. They’re in friendships, family relationships, and all the things we assume someone should do because they care about us. Sometimes we haven’t even told them what we expect, yet we still feel disappointed when they don’t meet it.
That’s the kind of material that made Hyouka rewarding for me. I’d been enjoying the festival without being completely taken by it, then the ending gave that earlier material more weight. It earned the reaction I’d been hoping for.
The standalone episodes were generally strong too. The banter, comedy, and quieter interactions often carried them even when the mystery itself wasn’t especially exciting to me. By the later episodes, I sometimes wanted the show to let these people spend time together without needing another puzzle, but I still enjoyed being around them.
Thinking about it as a whole, so much of Hyouka is about how people see themselves and what happens when someone else challenges that picture. Oreki has his idea of how much effort life is worth. Satoshi has his limits on what he believes he can become. Chitanda and Mayaka have expectations of themselves and the people around them. Then you get admiration, envy, pride, insecurity, and affection making all of that harder to keep neatly sorted. Someone can make you want more out of life while also making you painfully aware of what you think you lack. I didn’t find every character’s reasoning convincing, but I liked how much the show explored those uncomfortable feelings between people who care about each other.
Where that leaves me
I do think the lack of a second season limits what this anime could have become for me.
I’m happy with where the finale leaves Oreki and Chitanda at that moment. I’m less happy that this is where watching their lives stops. Those feelings can coexist. It seems entirely possible that some of their strongest material would come after the point the anime reaches, once the changes we’ve watched have more time to affect their lives.
Takemoto’s finale comments describe that same sense of reaching an ending while the characters’ lives are still beginning. I like that approach to the final scene. It also makes me wish we could follow them further.
Still, I don’t want everything I wished for to overshadow what I actually got. Hyouka gave me characters I enjoyed spending time with, a relationship whose gradual development worked for me, moments that made me laugh, and ideas I kept thinking about after the episodes ended. The care in the adaptation stayed remarkably consistent, even when my opinion of the writing didn’t.
I had a good time with this show. Sometimes I was frustrated because it was doing something I disliked; sometimes I was frustrated because I cared enough to want more. Both are part of how I came away from it.
My rating shifted quite a bit throughout the show. Before the film arc, I was thinking around an 8.25. After it, I was closer to a 7.75. The festival arc won me back over, and going into Episode 21, I was considering an 8–8.25 again. Then the Satoshi situation brought it down for me. The final score feels right for something I enjoyed this much but had a few substantial frustrations with.
7.75/10
Glad I finally watched it, and glad I got to discuss it with everyone here. There’s plenty I’ll remember fondly, even if a few things are still going to piss me off.
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u/Second_Cour 19d ago
You spend enough time watching these characters that a small change in how they look at each other becomes something you’re excited to see.
I was genuinely gleeful in a few of their scenes together. The growth in their relationship felt so incredibly organic, and by avoiding the usual romance tropes, even the slightest hint of them letting their guard down with each other felt so rewarding.
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u/ZapsZzz https://myanimelist.net/profile/ZapszzZ 18d ago
Great write up! Apologies if some of the ep21 discussions looks a bit heated - sometimes discussions on text miss out intent and context and can come across less friendly than intended. While I don't agree with some of the points you made, I certain respect that you are entitled to your opinions. Majority of the more subtle points we are in agreement anyway in most parts of the show, so I don't think we need to dwell on the differences too much.
Thanks for keeping an open mind and the detailed breakdown of what you liked and didn't like!
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u/dontoff 18d ago
That definitely happens a lot over text, so I apologize if I was a bit too much.
Regardless, I am so thankful that you hosted this rewatch and brought us all together for it. Honestly, I thought it was a very rewarding experience.
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u/ZapsZzz https://myanimelist.net/profile/ZapszzZ 18d ago
I had my years here learning a ton of stuff from rewatches, so I feel obliged to at least do a bit of pay it forward. While the recent years real life has given me far too much everyday to deal with and became more time poor than before, hosting a rewatch once every one or two years are probably ok. Hope to see you around more!
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u/Fools_Requiem https://myanimelist.net/profile/FoolsRequiem 19d ago
Rewatcher
This entire series revolves around the festival arc. It's a positive because it's generally pretty good, but also a hindrance. All of the episodes in the first cour (before the OVA) besides the hot springs episode are basically setting up the festival. Then the majority of the second half IS the festival. Then you get a bunch of random individual stories/mysteries after the festival. They couldn't really stretch out the stories leading up to and including the festival, but also couldn't just rush the story either because that would ruin the pace and slow, cozy vibe of the show. If you're going to keep going beyond the school festival, it definitely makes sense to end it on an episode with the cherry tree visual. So we're stuck with an odd number of episodes for a two cour season at 22 (not including the OVA). Having 5 episodes after the festival arc feel out of place, but you really kinda need them to have an almost full season.
| Episode | Chimes | "Watashi Kininarimasu" | "Chi-chans" | Goofy Satoshi Outfits | Bonus | --- | Episode | Chimes | "Watashi Kininarimasu" | "Chi-chans" | Goofy Satoshi Outfits | Bonus |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 1 | 4 | 3 | 0 | N/A | Flower animation | --- | 12 | 0 | 0 | 1 | GALAXY!!!! | Chitanda Costumes |
| 2 | 4 | 1 | 0 | N/A | Ibara Chimes - 1 | --- | 13 | 0 | 0 | 0 | Galaxy+Hat | Crystal Ball effect |
| 3 | 0 | 0 | 2 | Sunflower | Gameshow Nerds | --- | 14 | 0 | 1 | 0 | N/A | FIRE! |
| 4 | 0 | 1 | 5 | N/A | N/A | --- | 15 | 3 | 0.5 | 0 | N/A | Streeeeeetch |
| 5 | 0 | 0 | 2 | N/A | Yoko dropping books | --- | 16 | 2 | 2 | 3 | N/A | Just two future sister-in-laws walking past each other. |
| 6 | 4 | ∞ | 8 | N/A | One of my people! | --- | 17 | 1 | 0 | 0 | N/A | The End of the Festival |
| 7 | 2 | 1 | 2 | N/A | “I want to go” | --- | 18 | 1 | 2 | 0 | N/A | Chitanda checking to see what her future husband is interested in. |
| 8 | 2 | 1 | 1 | N/A | X ;o | --- | 19 | 0 | 0 | 0 | N/A | Chitanda is unconvinced |
| 9 | 0 | 1 | 1 | N/A | Chi-chan has a concussion now. | --- | 20 | 0 | 0 | 1 | N/A | Hermit Crab |
| 10 | 0 | 0 | 1 | N/A | N/A | --- | 21 | 0 | 0 | 4 | N/A | Detective Man |
| 11 | 0 | 0 | 0 | N/A | Short | --- | 22 | 0 | 1 | 0 | N/A | Cherry Tree |
| OVA | 2 | 1 | 2 | N/A | Watermelon or beach ball? | --- | Total | 25 | 15.5+∞ | 33 | N/A | Essential |
For some reason, Funimation's 'Essentials' BD release doesn't have Chitanda on any of the discs despite being pretty much the most important character in the show besides Oreki.
Also, next time, a "Chitanda stares into your soul" counter needs to happen. See you guys in a few years, I guess.
K-On rewatch when?
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u/TheDanubianCommunard 19d ago
First-time, subs
I mentioned back early on that my participation was not 100% guaranteed. Sure, for the early episodes I was there, watched it, and due to some reasons, just could not able continue and return ever again, basically abandoned it, which is a bad habit of mine, but since I was there I have to be here for the final day. Despite of it, I did kinda liked it and was enjoyable. The productions were stellar, as expected of Kyoani. As for the mysteries, it was kinda normal, understandable, sensible and logic, compared to Shoshimin (I say again, I did not liked that - my personal opinion). The Classic Literature Club actually did worked as a club and a group.
Even the 14th Anniverary thing was a bit weird but its better late (or early) than never.
I can answer some questions:
Of the main cast, who is the most memorable character and why
Everybody is likeable to me.
What would be the main category you classify this show as - Mystery? Romance? Drama? SoL? etc
Mystery first, then everything second.
If you were asked to sum up this show in 1 sentence, what would you say
Classical Literature Club doing Classical Literature Club things.
How much do you think the production value and directional flairs of KyoAni influenced your enjoyment/appreciation of the show? Pick another studio as a hypothetical and say how you think the adaptation would differ and how would you like that by comparison.
I say P.A. Works, I think it would not change that much fundamentally.
How would you rate this show as the category you slot this into, out of 10? Would you rate it differently if it's classified into a different category?
8/10
u/ZapsZzz, thank you for hosting this!
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u/ZapsZzz https://myanimelist.net/profile/ZapszzZ 18d ago
Hey there, thanks for circling back even if you couldn't quite drop in more. Thanks for sharing your thoughts by sharing my questions at least!
Was the 14th year anniversary bit weird because the number is not those regular 5's and 10's, or are you referring to the date of the rewatch not lining up to the start or end of the airing? The number is just the count, like how many days since Rebellion or how many years since Disappearance or how many years since NGNL ;)
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u/MishouMai 19d ago
This was a fun rewatch. Before this I hadn't seen the show since the original airing. And despite having an idea of the overall plotlines the show still remained fun to watch as I followed along with the different mysteries. Reading the comparisons to the source in the comments was fun as well as was seeing what others thought of the show. Thanks for hosting the rewatch u/ZapsZzz and to everyone else who I've spoken to throughout as well.
Questions of the Day
- Whilst I've made no secret that I'm more attracted to Irisu, Chitanda's catchphrase combined with her design has always made her a memorable
waifucharacter. Even when I forgot everyone else's name I remembered hers. Say what you will about waifu culture and everything, the girl needs no introduction. - Irisu. What can I say
I'm a pervert and she's sexy.but I love her design? She may not have a large role in the long run but seeing her pop up was always fun. - Hyouka is the story of Oreki learning to be less lazy and how to break out of his shell.
- I would say the first half is a mystery series with slice of life elements whilst the second half is a slice of life with mystery elements.
- Mm. I don't really watch a lot of mysteries. And while I did enjoy Hyouka both originally she in the rewatch there are definitely slice of life series I like more like Kiniro Mosaic, Ruri Rocks, etc. If those are an 8 or 9 I'd put Hyouka at a 7. Above average and nice to watch when it's there but not something I'd intentionally seek out or purchase merch or fanworks of. Honestly if it wasn't for the rewatch I don't think I would've bothered watching it a second time and if it hadn't been mentioned in one of the Fruits Basket rewatch threads then I don't think I'd have even known the rewatch was happening.
- Film > Cultural Festival/Jumonji > Sekitani June. While I would argue the Cultural Festival arc was more fun to watch, I would say the Film arc's mystery was more interesting/engaging.
Probably because of Irisu.The Sekitani June arc wasn't bad but it's mostly just there to introduce the cast and the give a taste for what the show is like. I can't say it's all that interesting compared to the other two arcs. - Oreki. He never really stopped feeling like a Mary Sue. That's not to say he's a bad character but even with the "help" he gets a lot of the time it doesn't feel like him solving the mysteries is very earned. I would've like to see the other three solve things in their own more or even get to be the one to solve the mystery instead of Oreki being the one with all the answers. Yeah he's the main character but still.
- Definitely the film arc. The whole film story and the twist with it being revealed Irisu was just using Oreki as an unwitting pawn is just really well done.
- Mm. I can't really think of any other media that Hyouka reminds me of. I'd say it's pretty unique, at least in my experience as an anime watcher.
- Not much. Like the show's gorgeous and everything but I feel like it could work just as well if it was made by, say, SHAFT or UFOTABLE. SHAFT might've dragged it out more or covered less of the story but as a Monogatari fan (I still need to catch up on that.) I think they'd do a good job of making it look visually interesting. Likewise I think Hyouka would look just as good if UFOTABLE was in charge, if not moreso. Kyoani's work is gorgeous, don't get me wrong, but they're not the only studio that could make it work. Keep the same way if writing and put it in another studio's hands and I feel it'd still hold up as a show.
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u/Eth_02 18d ago edited 18d ago
First time watcher.
Despite the less then ideal situation yesterday, I am still excited to participate in the final discussion. I'm gonna answer the questions first, before giving some final thoughts.
Question one. Eru. From the very first episode, I predicted that Eru alone might carry the show for me alone. That ended up not being as true as I had initially suspected, because the other main characters ended up being better then I initially thought they'd be. All four of then really are a lot of fun! With that said, I do believe Eru is still the heart of the show, and she's great!
Question two. Probably Irisu. I still have very mixed thoughts on her, but I can't say she doesn't leave an impression. She's what immediately comes to mind when I think of side characters from this show. Special mention goes to Eru's uncle too though. Despite not physically appearing, his presence is still strongly felt in that first arc, and it's still just such a strong opener for the show.
Question three. "The heartfelt joy of youth."
Maybe weird to some, but I think this show captures youth really well. When you're young, you can get curious about the little things, the random happenings of day to day life. That youthful wonder and curiosity! This show captures that so so well.
Question four. Slice of life. Despite on paper being about mysteries, the mysteries to me aren't the biggest draw here. It's the characters and character interactions. The romance side of it also isn't always present, so slice of life I think fits it best.
Question five. I don't really rate shows among categories often. I prefer to just give an overall rating. 8/10. Maybe 8.5/10. Probably 8.5!
Question six. The school festival and the first arc are my favorites. I'm still honestly not sure which one I liked more. They really are both so good. The other parts of the show were all good too, I don't know if I could clearly rank them though honestly.
Question seven. That I didn't get to watch the last episode. Hey I'm not saying that it doesn't have a second season as my answer, so I'm allowed to say that.
Aside from that though, as I said after a couple episodes, certain moments still feel a little contrived. It's nothing major, but these moments do happen. The one time we see Satoshi dragged away is the one time Oreki needs to get manipulated by someone. Oreki for example can break the shed just enough to grab the string, but not enough to unblock the door. Stuff like that. Nothing major that makes the experience bad or anything, just little things like that.
Question eight. Everything with the festival arc. The reveal and how it was all handled in particular was just stellar!
Question nine. Maybe not surprising since I mentioned it a few times in previous questions after certain episodes, but Hibike Euphonium. Maybe it's the similarly stellar production value, but I also think it's just how well done the characters are, and the subtle depth that they have. We really should do a Hibike rewatch here sometime!
Question ten. It definitely didn't hurt. It definitely wasn't carrying the show on it's own, as I loved the characters, but it definitely made it feel extra special. One thing I do wish is that they had kept episode ones vine thing. Maybe not every episode, but I do wish we'd seen it occasionally after the first episode. I guess you can justify it not being there again as Eru having captured his attention (or heart!) already! Besides, her eyes still sparkle everytime, so that's honestly enough! As for other studios, I honestly don't know if any other studio would do this type of show as well. Kyoani is pretty much unmatched in my opinion for these types of shows.
Okay so now for some final thoughts. Overall, fantastic experience, for both the show, and experience of discussing it. Thank you to our host and to everyone who took part in the conversation! It was really fun, and I dare say I might miss it for a little bit, it became part of my daily routine. This was my first time taking part in one of these, but I definitely see myself doing it again if another comes up for a show I'm interested in, or one that I've already seen and enjoyed. Hyouka is a pretty special show, and one I believe I'll think about for a long time! Thank you all for helping introduce me to it, and making the experience feel exciting! I didn't know what to really expect going in, but I had a kininarimasu moment and my curiosity payed off greatly!
Also once again, beautiful art!
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u/ZapsZzz https://myanimelist.net/profile/ZapszzZ 18d ago
Thanks for joining us! And great to see at least someone appreciates and commented on the really great fan arts ;) I hope you found your way to watch the final episode. Great to get another convert to vote for Chitanda in the next Best Girl contest ;D and thanks for regularly answering the QoTD's!
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u/mekerpan 18d ago
Glad people had a good time with this rewatch. I just couldn't find the time to join in this -- despite this being one of my very favorite anime series (and novel series). I would say that I prize this and Shoushimin pretty equally.
I find all four main characters indispensable, and I love them all. Their interactions are also so well crafted.
It is unfortunate that the novel series remains unfinished, but Shoushimin also had long breaks, and eventually reached its conclusion (albeit leaving room for a possible sequel).
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u/ZapsZzz https://myanimelist.net/profile/ZapszzZ 18d ago
Hey there friend! I understand being time poor, so your pooping by at the end is good enough already! See you around the sub! And thanks for that copium for one day Kotenbu getting the source finished at least!
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u/mekerpan 18d ago
I have more hope for more Hyouka than for the third and final (and essential) volume of Morimi's Uchoten Kazoku.
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u/ZapsZzz https://myanimelist.net/profile/ZapszzZ 18d ago edited 18d ago
Sub Rewatcher & Host
A big thanks for everyone in participating in this rewatch again!
It's amazing that this show was released 14 years ago by now. I hope everyone would agree - even if we have differing opinions on the writing and plot development choice - that in terms of production values, this show is still top of class even amongst today's majority of seasonals. While arguably this show rarely put something spectacularly up visually like the first episode's first kininarimasu scene, what it does do is to fill every little scene with all the details and flairs so there wasn't really any "pedestrian" scenes. i.e. while you don't see peaks likeViolet Evergarden or Makein, overall I personally believe Hyouka is not any less impressive than them.
Here's to hoping one day we can get a continuation, especially if we can somehow get this from KyoAni again despite how they no longer adapt works they don't own (or can heavily control) the IP rights. Add this to the list of Haruhi and Full Metal Panic :P
Key talking points of the complete work
- The character writing is great; it is a very character focused show, and you can really see and feel how the characters would behave in any given situations and there is a consistency theme maintained, including the fact that they are still developing and changing.
- The way the writing managed to work in some very strong and poignant messages from some seemingly unrelated things - often through the devices of "mystery being dissected and solved" - is really impressive.
- Out of all the story arcs, while the first establishing Hyouka arc had the most impact for first impressions, and the Kanya-sai arc had the most skilful complexity built up for display of the above key points, I love the final non-arc of "Chitanda and Oreki's relationship development" arc the most for how much you can see the result of all that time being spent together.
Production
As mentioned above while there weren’t too many particular wow moments of this show - there are some - what sets it apart is how high the bar is set for every scene. Not the same budget clearly, but most scenes are close to the Disappearance movie level of details and richness. In a way this is showing exactly what we are getting - while the “everyday” is ordinary and not supernatural, they are realistically vibrant and full of tones and details you can chew on, without being over-saturated over-punctuated like Ruri Rocks.
The music hasn’t been particularly mentioned by too many, but I think it has some really good tracks that are quite signature to some of the scenes, and again suits the understated tone of the show while literally channeling the tone “classics” really well.
The OP and ED were great along with the visuals - I think consensus is that the first OP is unbeatable, and the second ED has the best fun visuals. The second OP has less catchy/iconic vocals, but the visuals were great because it gave a very nice run down of what the second cour will go through including that visage of Chitanda tenderly drawing Oreki out from his world of isolation to where his friends are. By elimination the first ED is comparatively worse but even then the lyrics have very appropriate meaning to the show - you just need to look past the perhaps unnecessarily fanservicey visuals.
What I kept forgetting to bring up is that, particularly in the film making arc and the Juumonji part of the Kanya-sai arc, the scene direction was recreating some really great detective movies of old type scenes of introducing each potential suspect/victim like a lot of the Agatha Christie / Sherlock Holme movie adaptations - it’s really great for setting the tone. Especially the scene at the Magic Club show scene. All that’s missing are the subtitles of each characters ;)
Plot
I think a lot of people already written it very well, so I won’t labor it here again - except I do want to again quote the bit I really liked from the older rewatch about the last “arc”:
But to me the final five episodes are a wholly unique experience in the medium. The animation staff faced an issue in choosing to adapt the Classic Literature Club series of novels when they did. Namely, that the most recent content available to them at the time of their pre-production was the “The Doll that Took a Detour: Little Birds can Remember” ("Approximating the Distance between Two People" would release in 2010 but with KyoAni's atypically extensive production cycle it seems unlikely they would have had time to properly incorporate it into their plan) a series of narratively disconnected short stories the final five of which took place at the end of the chronology up to that point. Not exactly the nail-biting finale you would typically expect from most series. What this led the animators to creating was potentially the most extended dénouement anime has ever seen.
Most series—even long running Shonen anime—will end with both the climax and the finale at the end, or very close to. But here in Hyouka the narrative climax of the show happens at the end of the festival arc. Dénouements are best understood as the falling action of a work; the part of the story which clarifies the outcome of the events, typically through an emotional exploration of the characters. We should ask, therefore, what is being clarified about our characters in these final five episodes?
To me this comes back to what is established back in the very first scene: their relationship with a rose-coloured life. So far in the series our characters, and Houtarou in particular, have been forced into leading a rose-coloured life regardless of their own desires, whether it be Tomoe's faceless hand of fate leading her brother toward joining the Classics Club, Chitanda feeling a familial obligation to better understand the historical circumstances of her uncle, the manipulative whims of the Empress, Irisu, or simply a mistaken order of far too many anthology copies, the classics club has had little agency over what they get involved in over the course of the series so far. And this agency is what they're striving to recover over the course of this dénouement arc.
Rewatchers Fun
While it’s not like 86 or Violet Evergarden that every other scene has symbolism and foreshadowing that rewatchers can latch onto, there were still a lot of great “in your face foreshadowing” for rewatchers to smirk at:
- Satoshi’s remark that Oreki in trying to save himself the walking distance to the music room and created this phantom club recruitment mystery for Chitanda to be distracted on, he “won the battle and lost the war” and got her fully latching onto him for all her curiosity cases ;)
- All the progressive scenes of Satoshi seemingly laughing off his shortcomings vs the reveal he was an incredibly sore loser
- Etc.
Other Anime Recommendations / Comparisons*
In no particular order:
- Hyouka can be put on the KyoAni scale of seriousness around the middle: Violet Evergarden > Full Metal Panic TSR > Hibike Euphonium > Hyouka > Chuunibyou > K-On > Nichijou
- We are doing this rewatch while Sparks of Tomorrow is (was) airing, and I’ll take Hyouka’s writing and production over Sparks of Tomorrow any day.
- Oreki as the male lead is on the low end of the scale of “cynical MC”: Hachiman (SNAFU) > Kyon (Haruhi) > Oreki.
- Chitanda as a female lead is a polar opposite of the other KyoAni female leads on the “waifuness” scale: Chitanda >>> Rikka (Chuunibyou) > Haruhi (Haruhi) [Violet is off on a completely different scale]
- Chitanda’s final episode dialogue with Oreki heavily reminds me of [Bakemonogatari minor spoiler]Senjougahara “showing everything she owns”
- The dialogue of this show is really good and I place them on par with Benny Girl Senpai and Ground Control to Psychoelectric Girl
- For a low stakes SoL-y semi-rom com with at least similar tone of sentimentality - bad sadly way lower production value - the Disappearance of Nagato Yuki-chan is actually comparable. You do need to have watched main line Haruhi and the Disappearance movie first.
- Comparing to another “mystery/romance” show of Gosick, suddenly all the genre attributes spike up even more - mysteries that have most or all the pieces you can actually solve, well written and progressive relationship development, likeable characters.
- It’s quite tempting for me to compare Bunny Girl Senpai to Hyouka, however that show does have pretty firm supernatural elements and higher stakes.
Oh need to continue in part 2
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u/ZapsZzz https://myanimelist.net/profile/ZapszzZ 18d ago edited 18d ago
QoTD
1. Of the main cast, who is the most memorable character and why
Chitanda because of her much nicer version of “manic pixie dream girl” blend with “Yamato Nadeshiko”. Especially when she shows her more playful side (the bottle episode and the pool OVA episode). Oreki himself is a close second as a less “normal person” introvert who shows a great progression of opening up without losing his own identity.
- Of the side cast, who is most memorable and why
Juumonji - glasses girl who can do a deadpan joke delivery is a type I am weak to. Otherwise for fun it’d be the Astronomy club girl with her cooking from hell :D
- If you were asked to sum up this show in 1 sentence, what would you say
A calm and subtle coming of age story with some everyday mysteries to show the colors of life.
- or -
Come see Chitanda gently pulling Oreki to enjoy and step out of his grey world - as opposed to a certain yellow ribboned goddess dragging Kyon by the necktie viciously to all sorts of mayhem without her realizing.
- What would be the main category you classify this show as - Mystery? Romance? Drama? SoL? etc
A slow burn romance through mysteries as plot devices.
- How would you rate this show as the category you slot this into, out of 10? Would you rate it differently if it's classified into a different category?
10/10 for romance, 10/10 for drama, 9/10 for mystery
- How would you rank the arcs? Include the last 5 episode as an arc if you like - or not.
Oreki x Chitanda arc = Kanya sai > Hyouka > Film making
- What's the biggest problem you have about this show?
The subtleness often make people miss crucial nuances and explaining to them can get annoying. It’s like constantly needing to educate people not to take the word “prequel” in MAL to mean you should be watching that show first in “chronological order” (Fate Zero and Heaven’s Feel).
- Which mystery impressed you most
How deft that sleight of hand is to change from Juumonji-incident to The Kudryavka Sequence, with the matching switch in tone and motive.
- What other anime (or other shows in any medium) would you compare Hyouka most closely with?
Just because we had some much argument about the Valentine’s day incident, I’ll say 5cm per second. Otherwise my long answer is above in the anime comparison section.
- How much do you think the production value and directional flairs of KyoAni influenced your enjoyment/appreciation of the show? Pick another studio as a hypothetical and say how you think the adaptation would differ and how would you like that by comparison.
After first hand experiencing the difference between KyoAni and Xebec for Full Metal Panic Invisible Victory, I’ll say with full conviction that KyoAni turned a 8/10 story into a 10/10 anime. I already saw someone’s joke suggestion of having Trigger do the Kininarimasu scene; I’ll convert the UFOtable suggestion into the joke Wild Fire Cooking scene with particle effects, slow motion actions and dramatic cuts for the cooking and the final save of throwing and catching the flour :)
On a more mean-spirited and subjective comparison, swapping KyoAni with Shoushimin’s studio would get us many nice wall-paper-able background shifts but I think I won’t enjoy the character animations as much.
Bonus one for anyone game enough - how would you compare "The Classics Club" (Koten-bu) with "How to be Ordinary" (Shoushimin) from the same author?
The only easy way for me to say it unfortunately is in Chinese. Hyouka is a master class of fully using the slowness to build up great climaxes in natural, casual way - 不經意. Shoushimin feels a lot more “deliberate” and as such the peaks somehow felt a bit more “manufactured” - 刻意. I would not say they are like Violet Evergarden to Agents of Four Seasons though - that one was a lot worse in contrivance and manufactured drama.
Thanks once again for anyone still around to catch this last piece of writing! I had a lot of fun even if it’s been hard work for a busy working family adult life. Now back to
grind the seasonals I missedwork
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u/Slntreaper https://anilist.co/user/Slntreaper 19d ago edited 19d ago
Finally can type without spoiler tagging! It's rather unfortunate, because I still must tag my spoilers.
Of the main cast, who is the most memorable character and why Chitanda, no question, because Mery has burned her visage into my retinas.
Of the side cast (include anyone outside of the main), who is most memorable and why I guess Irisu, because out of recurring characters, she appears the most.
If you were asked to sum up this show in 1 sentence, what would you say Low-stakes drama/mystery with hints of romance, coupled with the best animation in the industry.
What would be the main category you classify this show as - Mystery? Romance? Drama? SoL? etc Mystery.
How would you rate this show as the category you slot this into, out of 10? Would you rate it differently if it's classified into a different category? 10/10 no notes
How would you rank the arcs? Include the last 5 episode as an arc if you like - or not. You can't escape - The niece of time: 9/10; The Credit Roll of the Fool - Why didn't she ask EBA?: 8/10; The Kudryavka Sequence - Welcome to KANYA FESTA!: 10/10; The Doll that Took a Detour - Little birds can remember: 8/10.
What's the biggest problem you have about this show (other than not having season 2)? Compared to the novel, Chitanda gets too close to Oreki too early. Their physical contact is relatively limited, especially in earlier novels, which makes little reveals like the Valentine's Day comment less special.
Which mystery impressed you most - whether it's the reveal, the setup/complexity, or if you could solve it before the reveal, etc. Anything goes. Volume 3's mystery is just so well put together. I love how all these little plots tie together to one big plot.
What other anime (or other shows in any medium) would you compare Hyouka most closely with? You can't escape from comparing it with Yonezawa-sensei's other adapted work: Shoushimin. I think Hyouka, both in novel and in anime form, is superior.
How much do you think the production value and directional flairs of KyoAni influenced your enjoyment/appreciation of the show? Pick another studio as a hypothetical and say how you think the adaptation would differ and how would you like that by comparison. Immensely improved it. Much of Hyouka is dialogue, and while that can feel dynamic on a page, once adapted there's temptations to cut corners and just cut shots back and forth between the talking characters. Hyouka does so much more, from the beautiful world around our characters to the visuals that help explain the story. For comparison, much of Shoushimin's first season is just that--characters talking to each other with shots interspersed. Studio Lapin does a decent job here (setting them in a variety of backdrops as they explain), but it's not Kyoani.
Bonus one for anyone game enough - how would you compare "The Classics Club" (Koten-bu) with "How to be Ordinary" (Shoushimin) from the same author? As I said earlier, I like Shoushimin as well, but it's just not as strong as Hyouka (I'm going to use the colloquial name for the series here). Osanai and Kobato cannot make up for what feels like missing deuteragonists. Kyoani absolutely knocks it out the park as well. My aim here is not to discourage anyone from watching Shoushimin; it's just that there needs to be some level-setting here. It's kind of like Violet Evergarden vs Agents of the Four Seasons (though truth be told I've only watched and not read the two series, and the adaptation of "Shoushimin" is much, much better than "Agents of the Four Seasons").
Random fact dump:
Hyouka's character design changed significantly over time. The anime (and now Mery) would eventually set the standard for our cast, but they went through a lot of changes to get there.
The r/Hyouka subreddit has a lot of fun facts about the series for those suffering from post-Hyouka depression.
On a more somber note, staff who were killed in the 2019 arson attack were immortalised in [Hibike Euphonium S3's final episode (obviously don't click the link if you don't want to be spoiled on the final episode):] https://www.reddit.com/r/hyouka/comments/1duynig/this_is_still_unconfirmed_by_kyoani_but_some_of/.
[Volume 6 spoilers] Once you read Even Though I'm Told I Now Have Wings, you realise that the show alone feels incomplete. I wish that Kyoani would adapt it, but alas, there are reasons both sentimental and sensible that make this a fantasy.
Since u/holofan4life starts every discussion thread with a commentary on how he joined this watchthrough, I guess I should end my participation with a few notes on why I joined. I was coming off of a "Violet Evergarden" rewatch (which itself was inspired by the less-than-stellar "Agents of the Four Seasons" that aired in spring of this year). At the same time, the r/anime Best Girl 13 competition was running, and Kumiko turned out to be a surprisingly tenacious underdog in her matchups. This caused more people to post Kumiko clips to try to get her to advance to the next round, and inevitably people started asking "DAE Kyoani made into yuribait show???" in each thread. I got super fed up with it and posted a few snippets from the light novel (which clearly no one has ever read, because they'd immediately see that Takeda-sensei just wrote Kumiko like that, and Kyoani was just understanding the assignment for what was [at the time of production] a single one-off light novel). A few days later, I saw the rewatch thread, and I decided to put to use my knowledge of the novels to bring something bespoke to the discussion.
Thank you to all who took part in these watch threads with me. I'd like to single out a few people who, either in this watchthrough or over the years, contributed greatly to my appreciation of Hyouka. First, u/ZapsZzz deserves a shoutout for running this rewatch series. You were always on time and never forgot to post (as opposed to me!). Additionally, thank you to u/polaristar, who isn't active on this subreddit but has given me a lot of knowledge about Hyouka on r/Hyouka. I'd also like to thank my brother (who shall remain untagged) for putting up with my random requests for the original Japanese text, as well as for introducing me to the novels. Finally, I want to thank "K" (who shall also remain untagged) for actually making me watch the show from start to end.
If you guys have any questions about the novel, feel free to ask me.
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u/MishouMai 19d ago
Damn. Looking at the design comparisons the anime designs are better for the most part. 2011 Mayaka is cuter than 2012 Mayaka but I dunno if that's a good thing or not.
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u/ZapsZzz https://myanimelist.net/profile/ZapszzZ 18d ago
Another big thanks to your efforts again and really great analysis, including various extras as well. This rewatch probably wouldn't have been as content rich without your contributions!
If you don't mind me prying, seeing you seem to enjoy reading source material as well, what are some of your favourite ones? For myself Haruhi and Full Metal Panic LN's are my top favourites, but there are some uncommon gems like Scraped Princess and - believe it or not - Yuushibu I quite liked. Still have a long list of PTR still though...
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u/Slntreaper https://anilist.co/user/Slntreaper 18d ago
Off the top of my head, I’ve only really read Hyouka, Shoushimin, the first volume of the Beruf series, Chou Kaguya-hime, Spice and Wolf, and the main Hibike! Euphonium novels. Of course, I read a lot more manga, as well as western fiction and nonfiction. I think the Hyouka series is my favorite. I’d like to get around to reading Violet Evergarden as well.
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u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky 19d ago
First-Timer, subbed
Yeah, I definitely enjoyed my time with this show. Out of the rewatches it overlapped with, this was the show I was most excited to watch the next episode of each day. I really liked both Oreki & Chitanda in particular, and Mayaka & Fukube both rounded out the main cast wonderfully. The culture festival arc and the final episode were probably my favorite sections of the show, but I can’t say I had a bad time with any of it. I think the only thing that kinda bothered me was that we didn’t get to see much resolution about the Manga Club treating Mayaka so poorly (I’ve heard the novels go into that more, though).
Thanks for hosting, u/ZapsZzz!
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u/ZapsZzz https://myanimelist.net/profile/ZapszzZ 18d ago
Thanks for joining, and great to see you at another 10 to your list ;) The manga club thing to be honest it's a relatively realistic depiction of real life bullying / harassment - most get away with it. It's not right but at the same time it's a hard think line to walk since no one can be protecting the bully target all the time.
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ 19d ago
secret squirrel
This is why I wasn't here.
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u/ZapsZzz https://myanimelist.net/profile/ZapszzZ 18d ago
While I am still slow-cooking my own comment in-between work, here's something for people who are interested to delve into more of each of the characters - their bookshelf:
https://pigcow-translations.com/2020/05/09/oreki-houtarous-bookshelf/
https://pigcow-translations.com/2020/05/30/chitanda-erus-bookshelf/
https://pigcow-translations.com/2020/11/21/fukube-satoshis-bookshelf/
https://pigcow-translations.com/2020/11/23/ibara-mayakas-bookshelf/
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u/heimdal77 18d ago
Out of curiosity was the ova watched? VT never mograted that episode over as far as I know.
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u/Second_Cour 19d ago
I left a shorter version at the end of the last episode's review, but here's the expanded form:
To judge an anime particularly highly it needs to change my life in some meaningful way. This show single-handedly changed the way that I look at anime. It made me pay attention to the thing that I ironically didn’t pay that much attention to: the animation. The story was always the most important part for me, and it still is, but I now see how much story telling can be in the visual side. I spent more time on this show than any I’ve watched before it: episodes commonly took me hours to get through, and their after effects lingered on as I replayed scenes in my head throughout each day. I felt a part of the beautiful reality that KyoAni created and got to know the cast on a very personal level. I loved the mysteries too: solving them was such an exciting spark for me, and what is a relatively calm slice of life became as exciting as an action packed show.
A big theme in this show was the lead's philosophy: the grey vs., rose coloured life. I appreciate that it never preached or tried to convince that one way holds more value over another, but showed that each had their strengths and weaknesses. Though one piece of delicious irony, is that one's enjoyment of the show is commensurate to how much work you're willing to put in. I was enjoying the first 3 epiodes, but after investing the time to double click on each dialogue, on each visual element, did my enjoyment of it skyrocket.
By choosing to put in effort and live the rose coloured life; by solving the mysteries: I noticed tonnes of other details which would otherwise have been missable. Tiny changes in body language as characters interacted with each other, hidden meanings revealed through careful word choices. Those all revealed a lot more than what a passive watch did, and it made me feel like I really got to know the characters on a deep personal level. Not that I'm that way inclined, but it'd be easy to write a second act to any episode, or to act it out in my head.
I liked that the mysteries were just there to allow the characters to develop, there was immense reward in becoming involved in them. Each was solvable if some work was applied by the viewer. There was only one mystery that was made purposefully simple (the valentine's chocolate one), with the show giving the viewer the answer straight away and ensuring that there was no way that we'd miss the answer, so that we can spend 20 minutes trying to understand the reasons for Satoshi's betrayal. I didn't think through why the mystery beat was changed at the time, but today I realised that for the one with the simplest solution, the implications were the most complicated for Houtarou, and the other characters. It had the power to change the group's dynamics, and all of their lives. It was unfortunate that we couldn't pursue that episode's afterburn as Season 2 didn't happen. It's been quite a while since watching that episode and I'm still thinking about it. I occasionally think about some of the others too. That's how much of an impression this show left on me.
Not long after finishing the final episode, I felt a little bit empty inside. This show will linger on for a long time, and finishing it feels like saying goodbye to an old friend. It's a tragedy that there's no second season, but I think I'll continue the story in manga form, which uses the same character designs. I imagine the mysteries will be a lot easier to solve, but I'll hopefully still have fun. I've said it before, but the lack of second season is indeed a tragedy, made even sadder as the director died in the arson attack on KyoAni. In a way this makes this work even more special: the man achieved a work that changed the way I watch anime.
I have to give Hyouka an incredibly high score, making it into my top 10.
8.5/10