Rewatch Hikaru no Go 25th Anniversary Rewatch: Episode 29 Discussion
The Twenty-Ninth Match: Kuwabara Honinbou
◄ Episode 28 | Index | Episode 30 ►
Series Information:
Streams:
Purchaseable:
On Apple TV or Prime Video.
Proverb of the Day:
Strike at the waist of the keima.
Tsumego of the Day:
Today's theme: Endgame tesujis!
Questions of the Day:
- Do you think Ogata takes good care of his fish, or pets in general?
- Have you ever asked a celebrity for an autograph?
Rewatchers, remember there are first-timers present!
Be careful not to spoil anything that hasn't happened yet in the show. If you wish to discuss something in the future, make sure to hide it under spoiler tags.
Spoiler tags work like this:
[Hikaru no Go]>!Sai is cute.!<
Which becomes: [Hikaru no Go]Sai is cute.
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u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky 8d ago
First-Timer no Go, subbed
Damn, Hikaru lost. That means no Hikaru vs. Akira yet, huh…
In today’s entry of completely unnecessary TL notes: – Actually they did it twice.
Okay the first time was kinda funny, but continuing to do it is kinda lame.
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u/wloff 8d ago
wloff's go corner #29
Touya Akira gained his 2 dan promotion in today's episode!
Promotions for professional players in Japan used to happen through the Oteai, a semi-annual ranking tournament with a weekly schedule. It was a bit of an interesting tournament: the games traditionally had no komi, but rather the old match handicap system was used where players would alternate black and white stones; and in the last years of the tournament, no game fees were paid to the players, so the only incentive to play was getting rank promotions.
Many players saw the Oteai as a bit of a chore, especially those who were involved in a lot of title qualifiers and had a lot of more meaningful games to play.
There was also an inherent problem with the Oteai: those who had already reached 9 dan were excluded, so the field would get constantly weaker and weaker, and as a result, the number of 9 dans was getting heavily inflated. In the 1990s, more than 20% of all pros were 9 dan.
The Oteai was discontinued in 2003; so, another big change that just barely missed Hikaru no Go, along with komi getting raised to 6.5!
Since then, your dan rank has been determined purely by your official professional matches, no matter what tournament or competition they're a part of. In addition, winning a title or getting close to winning one will instantly promote you to a high dan rank, so can actually skip several ranks if you do well in a big title tournament.
The current promotion rules are as follows. Only one requirement for any rank must be met.
Promotion to 9 dan
- Win Kisei, Meijin, or an international title
- Win Judan, Tengen, Honinbo, Oza or Gosei, twice in any combination
- Win 200 games as an 8 dan
Promotion to 8 dan
- Win Judan, Tengen, Honinbo, Oza or Gosei
- Challenge for Kisei, Meijin, or take second place in an international title
- Win 150 games as a 7 dan
Promotion to 7 dan
- Challenge for Judan, Tengen, Honinbo, Oza or Gosei
- Win Agon Kiriyama Cup or Ryusei
- Enter Kisei (S league) or Meijin leagues
- Win 120 games as a 6 dan
- Win most prize money amongst 6 dans in the year
Promotion to 6 dan
- Win 90 games as a 5 dan
- Win most or second most prize money amongst 5 dans in the year
Promotion to 5 dan
- Win 70 games as a 4 dan
- Win most or second most prize money amongst 4 dans in the year
Promotion to 4 dan
- Win 50 games as a 3 dan
- Win most or second most prize money amongst 3 dans in the year
Promotion to 3 dan
- Win 40 games as a 2 dan
- Win most or second most prize money amongst 2 dans in the year
Promotion to 2 dan
- Win 30 games as a 1 dan
- Win most or second most prize money amongst 1 dans in the year
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u/wloff 8d ago
Tsumego of the Day
Today's theme: Endgame tesujis!
I know, I know, for many of us studying endgames is kind of like eating your vegetables. But as we saw in Hikaru's tournament game, knowing your endgames will win you matches!
But let's at least do something a bit more fun than just counting points... let's try some endgame tesujis. These can be a bit tough, which is why I don't think I'll label any of them as "beginner" today!
- Intermediate 29-1. What is the best way for Black to reduce White's corner?
- Intermediate 29-2. Where is the tesuji that will enable Black to take the corner territory?
Intermediate 29-3. White's position looks strong. What is the most efficient way for Black to reduce White's territory?
Advanced 29-1. How can Black make an incursion into White's territory at the top?
Advanced 29-2. How can Black defend his corner territory in sente?
Solutions to yesterday's problems:
Beginner 28-1
- Black 1 immediately makes two eyes.
- Black 1 here allows White to throw in at 2. If Black captures at a, White b makes the second eye false.
Intermediate 28-1
- Black 1 is the key move. If White 2, Black 3, and Black is alive.
- Black 1 here is the wrong order. After White 2, the best Black can do is start a ko with 3.
Advanced 28-1
- Black 1 covers the cutting point while making enough space for eyes. If White 2, after Black 3 she has no way to prevent Black from making eyes.
- Black 1 and 3 also live in seki, but this result is at least four points worse for Black than the correct solution.
If you wish to discuss today's problems, please do so under spoiler tags, to give others the chance to solve them on their own! I'll be posting the solutions to today's problems tomorrow.
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u/Biokabe 7d ago
[Adv 29-1]At first I thought Q-19 was the best that Black could do here, but I think O-18 actually works and is obviously a much sharper incursion. White's best move is actually to connect at N-17 or block at N-18 (I think N-18 preserves more territory, but N-17 allows White to retain sente if the extra territory it saves is less worth than sente when Black plays O-18. I didn't read it all out, but to my eye N-18 looks absolutely hideous, but in endgame hideous moves are sometimes the best ones). If White doesn't connect, but instead tries to cut Black's stone off, Black can eventually cut off and kill some or all of White's stones on the right via throw-ins and exploiting a local shortage of liberties.
[Adv 29-2]I think P-19 is the move here. If White ignores it, he loses all of his territory, and the life of his stones might actually be in jeopardy. So he'll move behind it at Q-19. Black R-19 is next, and White can't just ignore it or Black O-18 starts a ko for life of the entire group, and Black gets to take the ko first. If this position comes up in the end game, there's almost certainly nothing left that can compensate for losing that White group, so White doesn't have the option to just let the group die and take profit elsewhere; he has to fight that ko, and the outcome will likely determine the match. So White will instead connect at O-18 himself, saving the group, but that means that Black has indeed protected his corner territory in sente.
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u/wloff 8d ago
Rewatcher and your host, E-F subs
So it's a loss for Hikaru as well.
But he has the perfect mindset about it. He's not trying to explain himself with "yeah but I was actually ahead in the middle game, believe me" or anything like that. He lost, and that's that, but he knows he did well. Much like Waya with his loss.
Touya "I don't care about Shindou" Akira is not beating any allegations. I like how Ogata is now the fish guy. He did have a fish tank, so it's nice consistency! He likes go, fast cars, white suits, stirring shit... and aquariums.
Learn your endgames, kids! Some really creative angles and shots in this scene.
Ohhhhh snap! We're starting to hype up the pro exam already!
Another insei study day, another NacDonald's day! I keep paying attention to Nase since she's the only featured girl, but it's slightly interesting that she often chooses to have lunch with this group rather than the female friends she has. I wonder if the implication is that she's the one genuinely strong female insei, and this is like the "top of the class" group?
...or, more realistically (and more boringly), this is the "all the named characters" group, and it just so happens that we just only really get to know one of the girls.
Everyone's starting to really notice and pay attention to Hikaru's growth. Akira, Ogata, Sai... and Waya, who's starting to see Hikaru as a legit threat in the upcoming pro exam. Is that a footballer (soccer player) poster on Waya's wall? Is Waya a football fan? I wonder what's his team...? Looking at the teams in the Greater Tokyo area, the colours might match the Kashiwa Reysol, but Kashiwa is an hour away from Tokyo and the Nihon Ki-in. I guess it's possible Waya lives all the way up there, or grew up there?
Speaking of legit threats in the pro exam... a new challenger appears!
QotD1: I like to think he does! He does have that "evil mastermind" aura, but he's actually been mostly helpful and considerate. And even evil masterminds classically have that white cat they love to pet.
QotD2: Nah. I've never had many people I'd idolize enough to care. And I'm sure I'd be too shy to ask, anyway!
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u/baboon_bassoon https://anilist.co/user/duffer 8d ago
first time baduker hikaru no go to the polls
rip Fuku's Ncdonald fries
theres a student version of the titles? Kadowaki looks v unimpressive if hes the guy in the last shot
my solutions for "yesterdays" tsumego
B28-1: Q2
I28-1: R15
A28-1: D2
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u/zambonijesus 8d ago edited 8d ago
Rewatcher, manga reader, subs
I can never tell if Ogata is intended to be a bit creepy or if he's meant to be cool.
I think I mentioned behind a spoiler earlier on about Kuwabara sensing Sai when walking by him and here's the episode where it happens. I respect Hikaru just refusing to learn who any of the professional players are or about the title holders. As obsessed with Go as he's become, Hikaru still doesn't care to watch the big matches except maybe if Touya Meijin is involved.
With the news that Akira has made 2-dan it occurs to me that I have no idea how the dan rankings work and should look into that at some point.
Edit: Just looked down and see that u/wloff addressed this very issue lol
[HnG]We're beginning my personal favorite stretch of the series now. Kuwabara is also my favorite pro player, he's such an old man troll.
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ 7d ago
I think I mentioned behind a spoiler earlier on about Kuwabara sensing Sai when walking by him
This was something I completely forgot about but picked up again sometime earlier in the rewatch.
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u/TradingStoicly 7d ago
First Timer Subbed
Super late on my comment today. I love how Akira still cares about Hikaru and hopes that he's able to reach his level. I'm really interested in Ogata though and seeing how he matches up against Kuwabara. It's insane that to challenge a title holder it takes 2 years. I'm not sure how they do it lol
QOTD: 1. He absolutely does imo. He looks like a very attentive guy 2. I don't think so. I remember getting an autograph from one of my friends in middle school who saw a football player at school. Never asked for one though
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ 8d ago
Rewatcher
Hikaru no Go ep 29
I have a feeling Waya is going to get banned.
- Waya wondering why Akira and Ogata were paying so much attention to the kid he eats hamburgers with.
- dude, can't you just wait for the kifu? I'll probably out by tomorrow!
- the other new pro is a bad winner too.
- oh it didn't occure to me that Waya thought Ogata and Akira were watching the pro....
- I think we've seen that old dude before...
- 55
- small and big?
- Did they still have school every other saturday in 2001?
- Isn't it inconvenient to play part of a tournament in Tokyo and then move to Sapporo?
- 55
Is there a limit on how many people can take the pro exam? I forget. That would me Waya's been taking up a slot. And Kadowaki takes up another. And Waga and Hikaru would have to fight for one.
It seems people have been able to perceive Sai over the last 1000 years, probably people with innate Go talent.
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u/wloff 8d ago
Did they still have school every other saturday in 2001?
Oh dang, that explains it! I did think it's a bit weird the insei only meet on some Saturdays and not all of them, but it makes sense if there's school otherwise.
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ 8d ago
I asked AI about 1990s Saturday schooling, and it said:
1990: half-day on Saturday
1992: 2nd Saturday off per month
1995: 2nd and 4th Saturday off per month
2002: 5 day school week
A teacher in a reddit thread says the schools are still open on Saturdays for club activities.
Saturday school returned in the 2010s due to concerns over falling performance. Abe in particular was opposed to yutori schooling.
Sounds a lot like the backlash to lockdown-era video schooling.
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u/Biokabe 7d ago
Rewatcher
On the one hand, I wanted Hikaru to win and get his rematch with Akira already. In general I'm not a big fan of delayed expectations/delayed gratification in narratives. In romance shows, for example, I absolutely detest the slow-burn romances. I don't find "Will they/won't they?" to be a compelling narrative. I think seeing what happens after the couple comes together is much more interesting than seeing whether the couple will come together.
And the same thing here. I wanted them to face off again, but narratively - it is still too soon for it. Hikaru may want to measure himself up against Akira already, but he's not yet close enough to make Akira justify the obsession. And for Akira... facing off against Hikaru right now would just lead to disappointment. I think he'd see more of what he saw in Hikaru when they first played, but it would be a shadow of that. And all that burning motivation he has right now might evaporate.
QotD 1: I think we're supposed to think he is. [HnG shopping spoilers]I believe we later see him visiting aquarium shops, and clearly he puts time into his tanks. However, in what I think is a prime example of not putting in the research, based on what we see on screen he doesn't. The food he feeds is wholly inadequate, his tanks are barebones and don't contain nearly enough shelter to make his fish feel secure, and his tank is too small for the fish he has. However, I 100% think that's just me looking at it from the standpoint of an actual aquarium keeper and the showrunners not doing the research on what is ultimately set dressing for Ogata's character. If Ogata were a real person, I do think that he would be taking good care of his fish, and he'd have the money to make sure they had everything they needed to thrive.
QotD 2: Technically yes, but also technically no. Scandal is my absolute favorite band, and I went to Sakuracon this year solely to see them. I don't normally care about autographs, but I wanted to get theirs. Due to missed timing and poor signage, I wasn't able to get the official merch that was all that they were signing after their concert. They had a few shirts left over that you could buy to sign, but I was a little too far behind in the line and it looked like they were likely to run out before I got my chance... so I bailed. And then earlier this year they announced that they were going to retire next year, so now I likely won't have another chance. Ah well, c'est la vie.
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u/ClearlyQ 8d ago
partial rewatcher, manga reader, subs
It's kind of funny how sort of nothing the Young Lions tournament turns out to be; the jr. high tournament had higher stakes in comparison. Pros were usually the ones that moved onto the subsequent rounds and that's what happened here, lol. So what this turned out to be really, is more like a stepping stone —getting to see Hikaru progress without moving too fast or too slowly or too same-y, more immersion in the insei and pro-side of Go, and another chance to get Hikaru and Touya in the same room. I forget what I ever expected out of this tourney when I first read the manga, if I even really had any expectations at all.
QoTD answers:
- I like to think so. He seems the kind of guy who enjoys being in control so I'd imagine that'd extend to aquarium upkeep. IDK if he's the type who'd name his fish but he'll probably have some sort of pride with regards to keeping them all vital and beautiful. I don't think he'd be an affectionate cat/rodent/dog owner though and IDK if I'd trust him with birds or reptiles either because those require more emotional investment than the fish he keeps. So maybe yes to the first half of the question and no to the second.
- Yeah! As a kid there were a couple of cosplayers I admired and I asked for their autographs during a convention. Funnily enough they were cosplaying Death Note characters at the time. And I got them to write their signatures in a Death Note replica I bought at that same con, haha... No idea where this notebook is now though.
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ 8d ago
Hikaru has learned that he really needs to focus on his end game, and that he can't rely on lucking out on his blunders.
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u/cppn02 7d ago
First Timer that almost forgot to comment today, subbed
Hikaru loses but he seems satisfied with his own performance. Plus it seems like he still gets to live rent free in Akira's head. And he now has his eyes on the pro exams.
We got a lot of Ogata this episode frist with him and Akira and later him apparently about the appear in a title match against the oldest man in Japan. Gonna be fun to see him actually play and not just stand in a room looking cool and teasing Akira.
QotD:
Do you think Ogata takes good care of his fish, or pets in general?
Absolutely
Have you ever asked a celebrity for an autograph?
Don't think I have.
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u/Heda-of-Aincrad https://myanimelist.net/profile/Heda-of-Aincrad 8d ago
First-Time Viewer no Go
That was kind of disappointing, to be honest. The fight Waya started in the last episode was just kind of over without being addressed again. I figured he would get in trouble, or at least be scolded for it or something. Then Hikaru lost his match immediately (why even bother with the cliffhanger at that point?) and didn't get to face Akira.
It looks like they've time skipped to summer, judging by everyone wearing short sleeves, so the pro exams are probably coming up soon?
As a side note, the aquarium views during Akira's talk with Ogata were cool. Definitely real fish this time because Ogata bought food for them.
Questions of the Day:
1) As far as I can tell, but they've only been in a few scenes.
2) Nope, never met one.