r/Athens • u/ParticuleFamous10001 • 1d ago
GA Supreme Court Ruling with massive ramifications for Athens
https://www.wabe.org/georgia-supreme-court-ruling-could-shift-more-fire-costs-to-property-taxpayers/If UGA doesn't have to pay any fees for any services, that could be ruinous.
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u/Classic_Wonder_2613 1d ago
Hashtag taxuga
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u/BizAnalystNotForHire Occasional Varsity Patron (RIP lost magnolia trees) 1d ago
To be clear, this ruling potentially does the opposite of that. And taxing them can't happen without substantial legislative action. And presented as you are saying is going to be wildly unpopular with the rest of the state/Bulldawg country whose representatives would need to vote for it.
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u/NotYetUtopian 1d ago
How about properties that don’t contribute to public services don’t get those services?
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u/ZealousJealousy 1d ago
In the spirit of not wanting to see any properties burn down and do harm, I'd propose that, yes, they get the service, but are expected to pay for it after along with some kind of fee. How much it would be and what that would be based on? I'm not sure, though I'm certain that someone more versed in this kind of situation would have a better idea. But it definitely seems better than just letting shit burn to the ground.
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u/captHij Sitting at a stoplight. 1d ago
I did not realize that state law specifies that certain organizations are exempt from paying property taxes:
https://law.justia.com/codes/georgia/title-48/chapter-5/article-2/part-1/section-48-5-41/
This includes many non-profit, educational, and state properties. The ruling cited by OP binds the hands of many local governments in a fairly profound way.
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u/ParticuleFamous10001 1d ago
Right? The law now urgently needs to be addressed by legislators. Or local governments (and fire services) (and the communities) will be hurt.
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u/hydrolojust 1d ago
Does this include schools and police response?
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u/ParticuleFamous10001 1d ago
I'm not clear on your question. This directly impacts things counties may charge as fees as opposed to labeled as taxes (storm water and fire being the ones I'm familiar with). It will impact all services that pull from the same pool of government funds.
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u/DanforthWhitcomb_ 1d ago
They are pointing out that public school systems and private schools don't pay property taxes either but still get full access to governmental services such as police and fire protection.
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u/ParticuleFamous10001 1d ago
Does this include schools and police response?
How does that equate to
They are pointing out that public school systems and private schools don't pay property taxes either but still get full access to governmental services such as police and fire protection.
I agree with your point, but that doesn't read that way at all to me.
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u/BizAnalystNotForHire Occasional Varsity Patron (RIP lost magnolia trees) 1d ago
Not an expert. It is highly unlikely to impact storm-water fees, by my reading, as that is generally tied directly to use. Though if there were infrastructure maintenance fees in regards to maintaining availability that got charged to properties regardless of use, that may be impacted, and the burden shifted to higher rates and possibly higher taxes.
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u/RagingAthhole Warnelldawg is my biggest fan 1d ago
“But we’re still going to go put out the fire if the [tax exempt organization] catches on fire, right?”
Nice campus you've got there ... be an awful shame if something were to happen to it ...
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u/AthensPoliticsNerd 1d ago
I don't think UGA currently pays fire service fees? I know Melissa Link wanted to try to enact that, but it never went anywhere. This doesn't affect us afaik? Does anyone have better information than me on this?
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u/Educational_Look_761 1d ago
Just guessing that the fee they’re concerned about may be the stormwater fee?
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u/AthensPoliticsNerd 23h ago
No, that one has been challenged before directly and it is legal. I would be surprised if that was affected by this.
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u/sweetgum-Balzac 1d ago
> “For instance, churches are exempt from property taxes, but they were paying the fire fee,” he said. “But we’re still going to go put out the fire if the church catches on fire, right?”
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u/RagingAthhole Warnelldawg is my biggest fan 1d ago
Are you advocating to let all non-tax-paying entities burn, or just churches?
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u/BansheeRadio 1d ago
Wouldn’t the county just increase the property tax for the university?
It was ruled as an unfair property tax disguised as a fee. Couldn’t the county take off the mask and simply assess it as a property tax ?
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u/MyFavoriteInsomnia Townie 1d ago
Does UGA even pay property tax?
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u/athensugadawg 1d ago
No.
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u/rowdy-goat 1d ago
UGA sucks resources from Athens. They are like a parasite you cant live without.
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u/Aggravating_Soil_990 Townie 1d ago
I think the word you’re looking for is symbiotic.
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u/Possible_Escape_9064 1d ago
UGA provides the community with museums, exhibits, jobs, and a steady flow of patronage into our local businesses. Yeah, there's some shady shit here and there, but they're not without their value to the community.
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u/RagingAthhole Warnelldawg is my biggest fan 1d ago
Athens only exists as it does - if at all - because of UGA. Whatever it is you like about Athens, UGA is why it's here.
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u/rowdy-goat 1d ago
Right, but they should pay their fair share of money athens uses provide uga with firefighting services.
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u/lostinteleportation4 1d ago
Almost like a parallel with red states sucking welfare and federal dollars then blaming blue states socialism. In this analogy I enjoy many things from UGA and red states, but wish they'd stop being asshats
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u/ParticuleFamous10001 1d ago
They do not pay any property taxes. ACC has been utilizing fees for storm water and fire to get around that.
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u/gurtthefrog 1d ago
1) UGA doesnt pay property tax
2) upping the rate for a specific property owner is certainly illegal and probably unconstitutional2
u/Aviator_John 1d ago
I’d argue the government has no duty to provide services including fire or police. They could sign a service agreement and pay for service or they cannot receive service and be forced to arrange their own. I like the idea of UGA Fire if this court ruling affects us.
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u/gurtthefrog 1d ago
I mean im not a lawyer but refusing to provide services to entities specifically protected from property tax on account of them not paying property tax sounds like an instant loss in court
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u/Aviator_John 1d ago
Well that’d be the main thing, you’re not charging them a tax. Private companies already in some areas provide their own fire service or pay companies to provide their fire service. Thats what chatham used to have before they switched to this model. You’ll see it in more rural areas where homeowners pay into a private company for service. This plan is that taxable properties already are opted in because they pay for it anyway. These tax exempt properties would have to arrange their own service, whether with ACC or by creating their own if they’re sizable like UGA.
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u/gurtthefrog 10h ago
The difference here is that orgs like UGA are specifically protected from tax, and requiring them to pay a fee for that reason seems unlikely to pass muster. Courts aren’t stupid - they know when local gov is trying to get away with calling a tax a fee.
Private orgs or homeowners paying fees, esp. in rural areas, is a whole other thing. They are paying for service above and beyond what the jurisdiction would reasonably be expected to provide due to the expense involved in running services into remote areas OR due to very high demand in urban areas. Again, the core issues UGA is specifically protected against property tax. Any scheme to get around that is always going to be a long shot.
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u/RagingAthhole Warnelldawg is my biggest fan 12h ago
"I’d argue the government has no duty to provide services"
What, then, is its purpose for existing?
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u/BizAnalystNotForHire Occasional Varsity Patron (RIP lost magnolia trees) 1d ago
Here is the GA Supreme Court decision: https://www.gasupreme.us/wp-content/uploads/2026/10/s26a0699.pdf
Here is the relevant laws:
https://codes.findlaw.com/ga/title-48-revenue-and-taxation/ga-code-sect-48-5-1/
https://codes.findlaw.com/ga/title-48-revenue-and-taxation/ga-code-sect-48-5-41/
https://codes.findlaw.com/ga/title-48-revenue-and-taxation/ga-code-sect-48-5-380/
The deposition testimony of the CES Fire Chief and the County Manager confirmed that the County was obligated to respond to all calls for fire protection service in the Fire Service Area, regardless of whether a property owner had paid the Fire Fee;
It's particularly rough that the law is pushing governments towards limiting fire fighting/ fire protection services to those who have paid for it. It harkens back to the 1st century BC in Rome, the wealthy politician Marcus Licinius Crassus formed a private brigade of 500 slaves who were trained architects, builders, and firefighters. When a building caught fire, Crassus would bargain to buy the property for a fraction of its value from the desperate owner before letting his crew put out the flames, or letting it burn if the owner refused to sell. It was rumored that the fires were not always innocently started.
In the 1700s-1900s, various large cities had fire insurance marks on buildings where private fire departments would save a building if they saw it had the mark on the outside. At various points through out it, they moved to public fire departments. There is damage and risk to everyone from those that don't have it. A fire can get out of control pretty easily in the right conditions. They all recognized it back then and moved to making it a public service.
https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna39516346
How have we not learned from history that having and supporting a standing fire department is good for everybody? I understand we generally haven't personally witnessed fire destruction like the out of control wildfires out west, but fire can easily get that way. Georgia experiences droughts. This is potentially dangerious to communities. We need to have the legislative backing to have the tax infrastructure to pay for that government service, not backtrack.
The law needs to be updated.
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u/MattCW1701 1d ago
For everyone mad at the court or its ruling, it's a legally correct ruling. If you aren't happy with it, write your legislator to change the law.