"They low-down. They dirty. They some snitches." — The backstory

[u/robotunes]

Bama has always hated Tennessee, but the following episode took the hate to a deeper level and inspired one of the best sermons in college football.

THEY LOW-DOWN

In the mid-'90s, the NCAA was on Tennessee's campus investigating payments to players and recruits. 

THEY DIRTY

The bag operation was financed since the '60s by notorious Memphis booster Roy Adams. 

How do we know this? Because Adams said so, telling the NY Times in 2013: "I knew the NCAA rules. I just didn't care for them."

THEY SOME SNITCHES

Caught red-handed, Tennessee coach Fat Phil Fulmer told the NCAA, "If you let us go, we will give you Alabama."

Tennessee was mad that a rogue Bama booster had outbid them for a recruit from Memphis -- the hometown of Roy Adams. By snitching, Tennessee gets off scot-free and in 2002 Alabama catches the near-death penalty for our 2nd major violation in 5 years.

The sanctions cause the deep fall of Alabama football and the embarrassing coaching carousel that some people in this sub may remember. 

AMEN

Fast-forward to 2007: Saban comes to Tuscaloosa. During Tennessee week, a reporter visits Bama's campus to take the temperature of students toward Tennessee.

*A Few Days Later*: Alabama emphatically stops Tennessee's 11-3 run in the series with a 41-17 beatdown and it felt so good.

[u/ISU_Dude85]

I worked at a bank in college. We had these two tech guys come update the system we were using; their job was traveling the country doing this. They were both from Alabama; one was an Alabama fan and the other was an Auburn fan. I made a joke about having to travel with a rival fan, and without hesitation the Alabama fan told me how much more he hates Tennessee than Auburn. That was a surprise to me.

[u/RealBenWoodruff → u/ISU_Dude85]

You hate Auburn because you have to. You hate Tennessee because you want to.

[u/bucki_fan → u/RealBenWoodruff]

It's nice to be able to channel all hate in one direction at a single entity who overwhelmingly deserves all of the vitriol.

But, I do enjoy watching others manage themselves like this

[u/sunburntredneck → u/bucki_fan]

Congrats on suppressing every other football program in your state (of 12 million people, far more than Alabama and other states with multiple flagship programs) so you wouldn't have an in state rivalry

[u/Gobe182 → u/sunburntredneck]

Didn’t bama regents do exactly this with UAB?

[u/regalusername → u/ISU_Dude85]

I hate Tennessee. I hate Auburn too but god I hate Tennessee. Auburn gets the hate cause I have to hate them. I choose to hate Tennessee.

[u/clduab11 → u/regalusername]

I hate them because they low down, they dirty, and they some snitches.

[u/mmps901 → u/clduab11]

Not a dog person eh?

[u/clduab11 → u/mmps901]

Don’t you dare put the cuteness of Smokey up in my face; I’ll spoil him with treats and cuddles and you’ll never see him again.

[u/Emergency_Lobster514 → u/clduab11]

And they all look like a garbage worker convention.

[u/ThrowRA_looking → u/regalusername]

I hate Georgia more than bama. Bama is bama Georgia barks

[u/LeonardMcWhoopass → u/regalusername]

This is what Texas A&M is like for many of us Tigers

[u/Intelligent_Dress347 → u/ISU_Dude85]

Some younger fans hate Auburn more - we kicked UT’s ass for a decade and a half, Kick 6, yada yada

But it’s almost universal for any fans my age and older to hate Tennessee more. 

[u/Vulcion → u/Intelligent_Dress347]

Can confirm. Born in 2001, can barely remember any football pre 2007, for the vast majority of my life Tennessee has been nothing more than a tune up game.

[u/Trigonometry_Fletch → u/ISU_Dude85]

Not me

[u/tider06 → u/Trigonometry_Fletch]

Even The Bear hated Tennessee more than Aubarn.

[u/robotunes → u/tider06]

The Bear played the whole 1935 Bama-Tennessee game with a cracked bone in his leg. You damn right he hated Tennessee.

[u/DarthMrMiyagi1066 → u/ISU_Dude85]

Auburn is like your little brother. You beat their ass consistently because you’re their big bro. You need to toughen them up for the world. But you somewhat care maybe a little or really not at all. Then every once in a while they catch you with that right hook that puts you on your ass. You sit there thinking damn, they got me. And then they go on and do it to other people and you’re a little proud. Not a lot, and probably not at all, but maybe some.

Fuck Tennessee.

[u/Laney20 → u/ISU_Dude85]

We share a state with auburn fans. We have to live with them. Tennessee fans, though....

[u/regalusername]

If this game or the iron bowl is ever taken away, it will be my personal 9/11. This game and the iron bowl are what fuels me as a bama fan and as a college football fan in general. Georgia may be becoming a short term/ mid term rival but man oh man they will never replace Tennessee and Auburn. The 3rd Saturday in October and the Iron Bowl are the lifeblood of southern football and I’m not afraid to say it.

[u/Autoimmunity → u/regalusername]

I mean, I feel the same way about the Cocktail Party.  There are a few rivalries in the SEC that are absolutely sacred and cannot be touched or the sport is dead.

Guess you can add the Egg Bowl and Red River Shootout to that list now too

[u/regalusername → u/Autoimmunity]

If this new playoff format causes these sacred games to not matter then we have genuinely lost the plot and need to start over. The soul of the game is for sale and the mouse is buying all.

[u/ewgrooss → u/regalusername]

I don’t care what the records are, hell I don’t even care what game we’re playing, I don’t ever want to lose to Tennessee.

[u/MatticusGisicus → u/Autoimmunity]

Excuse me, “now?” Don’t disrespect the Egg Bowl like that just because you haven’t been paying attention

[u/Autoimmunity → u/MatticusGisicus]

Haha, no disrespect meant, I simply was adding to OPs original two games with one that means a lot to me. The Egg Bowl is obviously hugely important to Mississippi and SEC history.

[u/Mantis_Toboggan_M-D → u/Autoimmunity]

2019 Egg Bowl Ole Piss ending. I pull it up on YouTube at least once a year to show someone who doesn't know

[u/StanderdStaples → u/regalusername]

GA v Bama isn’t even a true heated rivalry - it’s just consistently damn good football, must watch television with vibes that always feel like the natty is on the line that night

[u/shuzgibs123 → u/regalusername]

🧡

[u/regalusername → u/shuzgibs123]

Fuck you and see you tomorrow. ❤️

[u/shuzgibs123 → u/regalusername]

Can’t wait! I 🧡 TSIO.

[u/Junkie4Divs → u/regalusername]

Hey buddy the Alabama 9/11 was the loss the ULM. Some of us hold these traditions sacred.

[u/regalusername → u/Junkie4Divs]

First off, holy flair. Second off, I did say personal 9/11. Third off, I was at the ULM game with my dad. I was 11 and it never really hit me till later looking back on it how bad that loss truly was. I remember walking out of the stadium and people just being in shock. Like people would start to talk and just stop. In my 11 year old mind at the time I thought they were going to fire Saban. Then things changed. The rest is now a documentary.

[u/Financial-Swim-5884 → u/regalusername]

I was also at that game. I use the game day shirt to wash my car and dog.

[u/Critical_Meringue78 → u/Financial-Swim-5884]

I burned mine and told my Auburn fan wife that Saban wasn't worth $4 let alone $4MILLION. She reminded me of that several times over the years.

[u/Junkie4Divs → u/regalusername]

Two degree two schools 😁 I was there too! That was my freshman year at Alabama and what I remember most about that game was the nightlife being dead. I didn't understand that the entire campus social scene hinged on how successful the team was. I learned quickly though 😂😂

[u/regalusername → u/Junkie4Divs]

I think the school enrollment at Alabama went from like 25k to 42k between 2007 and 2025 so it’s safe to say the football success definitely drove the campus social life up.

[u/Mj8559 → u/Junkie4Divs]

My first season with UT season tickets was 2021. 9/11 is bad, but it’s got nothing on watching, Kiffen, Dooley, Butch and the guy who doesn’t know what an asparagus is destroy our historic program.

[u/Intelligent_Dress347 → u/Junkie4Divs]

UCF Homecoming 2000

USM Shutout 2000

There’s life before and after Dubose.

[u/ddadopt → u/regalusername]

We'd miss you, too. No one would say, "good thing we don't have to play 'Bama this year," it would be 100% "Fuck ESPN."

[u/ThrowRA_looking → u/regalusername]

Some of the best football id go to the iron bowl.

[u/lowes18]

Albert Means was just ahead of his time tbh, outright demanding payments for visits.

[u/bamachine → u/lowes18]

Sad thing is it wasn't him, it was his high school coaches that were cashing in on him. He didn't get jack shit.

[u/StanderdStaples]

The whole thing is legendary… but the fact that it’s clearly his second time saying all this, and even then - mic goes down and he still “can’t stress that enough”

My man would have kept talking as long as they wanted him to - pure hatred, just the absolute definition of rivalries in college football

[u/Financial-Swim-5884]

I say it every year and I'll say it again in the game thread tomorrow.

I hate Auburn because I have to.
I hate Tennessee because I want to.

[u/iSightTwentyTwenty → u/Financial-Swim-5884]

Being an Alabamian, we are forced to live with, work with, drink with (sometimes sleep with), and do business with Auburn folks. They’re everywhere and we are everywhere. It’s an inherent part of Alabama culture unlike many big time rivalries(ou/ut, osu/um, UGA/uf, etc.). Most of us learn to live with and get along with each other half the year, however, we choose not to be friends with Tennessee folks.

[u/Financial-Swim-5884 → u/iSightTwentyTwenty]

"I can work with people with different opinions, but this is a moral issue."

[u/bamachine → u/Financial-Swim-5884]

I hate people who are intolerant of other people's culture...and the Vols

[u/Jabberwoockie → u/iSightTwentyTwenty]

We actually understand that entirely, we have Sparty.

I’ve pretty much said the exact same thing about the MSU rivalry and the OSU rivalry.

We hate Sparty because they’re our brother. We hate the Buckeyes because there’s almost nothing worse.

[u/Financial-Swim-5884 → u/Jabberwoockie]

The only thing worse (outside of Tennessee) than a Buckeye is a Trojan.

[u/Laney20 → u/iSightTwentyTwenty]

This is what I think makes the iron bowl a better rivalry than those others. Out of state rivalries are just different because when it's over, you go back to your corners and kind of ignore each other.

[u/Icy_Escape8018]

The best part about this story is the proper use of the word snitch. If I commit a crime with someone or have knowledge of criminal acts and I roll on that person, that makes me a snitch. If I report a crime, that doesn't make me a snitch.

[u/xbox_srox → u/Icy_Escape8018]

As a Michigan fan, I trust your opinion on this topic.

[u/nogreatideas → u/xbox_srox]

The voice of experience!

[u/Icy_Escape8018 → u/nogreatideas]

Lol. You had enough of your own scandals. Sit this one out

[u/Icy_Escape8018 → u/xbox_srox]

Saban retired because playing players became legal. The best part about that Michigan win was Saban retiring. He saw the writing on the wall. Then goes on to try to be the moral authority on NIL. GTFO

[u/Ok-Being3970 → u/Icy_Escape8018]

How old was he, and what was his average recruiting class ranking post NIL?

[u/Icy_Escape8018 → u/Ok-Being3970]

He literally said he retired because of NIL

[u/Ok-Being3970 → u/Icy_Escape8018]

No he didn't. He said he retired for a multitude of reasons, mainly being age. You can watch any number of interviews where he's mentioned this - including where he expressly denied retiring due to NIL

https://sports.yahoo.com/articles/nick-saban-blunt-retirement-leaves-190401836.html

[u/Icy_Escape8018 → u/Ok-Being3970]

He retired because the bag man he used became legal.

[u/Ok-Being3970 → u/Icy_Escape8018]

What was Saban's average recruiting class post NIL

[u/ATaxiNumber1729]

Fall 2002 was my first semester in Tuscaloosa 😐

[u/tider06 → u/ATaxiNumber1729]

Mine was Fall 2003 and I graduated in 2006. My campus time only involved the Shula years.

[u/Buckiller → u/tider06]

Damn I bet you were on top of the world when we stomped UF at home.

[u/tider06 → u/Buckiller]

We were until the 4th quarter, when Prothro got injured.

Sucked all the joy out of the whole season, really.

[u/bamachine → u/tider06]

Yeah, that was the loudest sustained noise I had heard in BDS, then the quietest after his injury. I had season tickets from 2003-2019.

[u/letmypeoplebathe → u/ATaxiNumber1729]

I mean I think it's worked out pretty well since then. It could have been worse

[u/robotunes → u/letmypeoplebathe]

Coincidentally, fall 2002 is when the NCAA rejected Bama's appeal of the sanctions. About to face 5 years of sanctions for stuff he didn't do, coach Dennis Franchione finished out the year and went to Texas A&M.

[u/ATaxiNumber1729 → u/robotunes]

And then hired Mike Price, who was fired before he coached a fall practice haha

[u/robotunes → u/ATaxiNumber1729]

Dodged a bullet with Mike Price. He named one of his inexperienced sons as the QB coach and the other inexperienced son as office coordinator.

After Mike got himself fired, the Bama athletic department reassigned the sons and eventually got rid of them. Both still list Alabama on their bios even though they never coached a game.

I'm convinced that Mike Price planned to retire on the job and build a nepotism factory that would have doomed Alabama. Destiny had other plans haha!!!

[u/letmypeoplebathe → u/robotunes]

And thus began our torment

[u/xMatch → u/letmypeoplebathe]

It goes back farther than that. Probably around 1957.

[u/BrilliantArm5914 → u/ATaxiNumber1729]

it was also a very good time to buy tech stocks

[u/exit10243]

I hope that dude is doing well wherever he is. This clip has brought me joy for many years and I don’t have a dog in the fight.

[u/robotunes → u/exit10243]

Here he is in 2016, looking back on the quote that made him famous.

Here he is last month, as recipient of the Technologist of the Year Award at the STEMmys in Cincinnati.

[u/Intelligent_Dress347 → u/robotunes]

Awesome to see him doing well. Where Legends Are Made!

[u/robotunes → u/Intelligent_Dress347]

Where Legends Are Made!

I love how in the 2016 clip he says, "I like that it's kind of getting ingrained into the Alabama culture. I've writ my name in Crimson flame, y'know."

Great callback to Bama's fight song, written in 1926 after the team won the Rose Bowl and put Bama football on the map: "For Bama’s pluck and grit have writ her name in Crimson flame."

That's a true fan, right there. Built By Bama!

[u/Intelligent_Dress347 → u/robotunes]

Love it

[u/tinatimmay]

IIRC, UK's Claude Bassett got caught doing the same thing, for a different player at the Memphis HS. The funny thing is the difference UK was paying for their player vs what Alabama was paying for theirs ($20k vs $200k, i think). Also, Claude Basset paid with an official UK Check from the Athletic Department.

The more important part of this story, is that this event ended the Mumme/Leach Air Raid at Kentucky. Another chance in the long story of 'what if's' in UK Football history.

Next time Kids, we'll learn how the UK Basketball gambling scandal in the 50's led to Bear Bryant leaving for TAMU.

[u/robotunes → u/tinatimmay]

$200k, i think

$150,000 from a booster, not Alabama. Bama was already under NCAA sanctions and told boosters to cut that shit out. The booster, Logan Young, was later convicted of racketeering in connection with the payments, and records during his federal court trial showed he acted alone.

As soon as Bama found out what he did, the school disassociated from Young, who would die under mysterious circumstances.

And yes, kids, it's only a myth that Bear Bryant left UK because he got a watch while Rupp got a Cadillac.

[u/bamachine → u/robotunes]

Yeah, the watch/caddy story is a fun but false anecdote but it was indicative of the attitude at Kentucky, then, how football was not going to get the same resources put into it that the hoops program was getting.

[u/tinatimmay → u/bamachine]

He left because he didn't want to be associated with a school that just got busted in a gambling scandal. The watch/caddy narrative was an easier pill to swallow than reality. Which was UK had a bad national reputation in the 50's due to the Gambling scandal (IMO). Kentucky is the South, and as Southerners, we're great at redefining our motives after the fact.

[u/ScrofessorLongHair → u/tinatimmay]

I bet, just to be safe, y'all already have bought Will Stein a Cadillac.

[u/BenCisco]

That clip NEVER gets old. 

[u/StFuzzySlippers]

Damn, those were good times. A wholesome, heartwarming tale with a strong moral for the kids. And that moral is FUCK BAMA. We'd fuckin do it again.

[u/robotunes → u/StFuzzySlippers]

You sure you wanna do that? Last time y'all did, we wound up with Saban.

[u/StFuzzySlippers → u/robotunes]

True, but you had to go through Shula, Price, and Franchione to get there

[u/xMatch → u/StFuzzySlippers]

My wife and I had a baby boy in December, 2006. He was SIXTEEN YEARS OLD before he knew what it felt like to lose to Tennessee.

[u/robotunes → u/StFuzzySlippers]

And we'd fuckin do it again.

[u/seventeenthirdyeight → u/StFuzzySlippers]

Ayyy another Vol/Blazer

[u/Is12345aweakpassword]

And then the SEC commissioner said “guys, if you stop ratting each other out we can just pay allll these people under the table all the time!”

And thus, the foundation for the SECs rise was set

[u/mayence → u/Is12345aweakpassword]

	c	d
c	3,3	1,4
d	4,1	2,2

[u/mcaffrey]

I didn’t know the story, so thanks.

What is Tennessee’s side?

[u/GoldFingerSilverSerf → u/mcaffrey]

Tennessee’s side is unofficially - 🤷

Yeah he snitched, would rather Bama go down than us. Tennessee and the NCAA have always had a peculiar relationship and mostly in very bad ways for our program. This one just happens to be peculiar in a way that hurt Bama.

[u/Financial-Swim-5884 → u/GoldFingerSilverSerf]

I would say that after a decade and a half of the rivalry being noncompetitive, we've adequately paid you back for it.

[u/GoldFingerSilverSerf → u/Financial-Swim-5884]

I would agree with that 🤣

2-2 last 4 years baby. This rivalry is historically streaky. I’ve been around for at least two of those streaks. Past is past.

[u/Financial-Swim-5884 → u/GoldFingerSilverSerf]

Oh, to be clear, I'm very happy it's back to being competitive. Though it did ruin a pretty good joke about a backflipping dog I used to tell...

[u/tider06 → u/Financial-Swim-5884]

I'm not.

[u/Financial-Swim-5884 → u/tider06]

Gotta have a few rainy days to appreciate the sunny ones.

[u/ScrofessorLongHair → u/Financial-Swim-5884]

Tennessee after Bama hangs 15 in a row...

https://i.imgur.com/WbvsjYo.jpeg

[u/xbox_srox → u/GoldFingerSilverSerf]

They didn't call the program Teflon Tennessee for nothing.

[u/Hypocracy → u/mcaffrey]

I mean, we definitely did it, the reason we could turn in Bama is because we got outbid in Memphis by Bama. Ain’t no revisionist history saying we were some squeaky clean angel program, but when the NCAA was trying to gun programs down at the time, you needed to make sure you weren’t the one in front of the gun

[u/Irreverant77 → u/Hypocracy]

Teflon don't squeak

[u/Drewey26 → u/mcaffrey]

No one knows since they're all at the garbage truck workers' convention

[u/DerrickWhiteMVP → u/Drewey26]

Are Bama fans at the unemployment office while they bitch about welfare queens on Facebook?

[u/Financial-Swim-5884 → u/DerrickWhiteMVP]

Don't be ridiculous. We are the welfare queens.

[u/wanderingdg → u/Financial-Swim-5884]

*WHOOSH*

[u/Financial-Swim-5884 → u/wanderingdg]

Listen it's been a long day.

[u/Drewey26 → u/DerrickWhiteMVP]

Whoosh

[u/Mowers_01 → u/DerrickWhiteMVP]

Yes

[u/VolsTuba13 → u/mcaffrey]

Fuck Bama. That’s the story.

[u/Fit_Alternative3563 → u/VolsTuba13]

That’s the version of the story I heard too…

[u/Irreverant77 → u/mcaffrey]

What is Tennessee's side?

Fuck Bama

[u/Garfunkel_Oates → u/mcaffrey]

Sometimes people make stuff up.

[u/robotunes → u/Garfunkel_Oates]

Court documents show Fulmer twice called NCAA staffer Rich Johanningmeier, who was probing alleged wrongdoing at Alabama in 2000, and gave him information implicating the Tide in rules violations

[u/Rnorman3 → u/robotunes]

So instead of being mad that your school was cheating, you’re mad that they got caught.

I’m not saying we are squeaky clean either, but this whole situation has always been sour grapes. Don’t act for half a second that bama wouldn’t have done the exact same thing to Tennessee if given the chance.

[u/robotunes → u/Rnorman3]

Bama could have done the same thing throughout the '70s, '80s and '90s but never did. Roy Adams was well known to all SEC football administrators and to many fans (I heard about him as a Bama student in the early '80s), but nobody throughout the SEC said a word.

Bama was already on probation for major violations but we didn't snitch on Tennessee. NCAA shows up in Knoxville and immediately y'all turn into a bunch of low-down, dirty snitches.

[u/Rnorman3 → u/robotunes]

“Bama could have done the same thing!”

No the fuck they couldn’t. Because if they could have, they would have. This rivalry is older than any of us and built on a foundation of hate that you clearly can’t fathom, despite writing this OP.

Everyone was bending it breaking the rules back then and there might have been a gentleman’s agreement around “don’t ask don’t tell” but you act like Roy Adams was the only guy who was doing it or who was “well known.” If anyone close to the bama program had the ability to turn him in to hurt Tennessee without implicating themselves, they would have done it in a heartbeat.

Tl;dr: provide a source for your claim that bama actively passed on turning Tennessee in to the NCAA or shut the fuck up.

[u/robotunes → u/Rnorman3]

you act like Roy Adams was the only guy who was doing it

Learn to read. I already said we were on probation for major violations when y'all snitched.

[u/robotunes → u/Rnorman3]

Tl;dr: provide a source for your claim that bama actively passed on turning Tennessee in to the NCAA or shut the fuck up.

According to that NY Times story I linked to, Roy Adams' home had a photo of him shaking hands with Nick Saban. You think Saban didn't know who Roy was and what he was doing for Tennessee football? Did Saban ever snitch on Tennessee football? No, he actually tried to help Tennessee during yall's 2017 clown show of a coaching search by recommending his defensive coordinator, Jeremy Pruitt, to Tennessee's athletic department

This rivalry is older than any of us and built on a foundation of hate that you clearly can’t fathom, despite writing this OP.

Son, I was alive when Bama started the tradition of smoking a cigar after beating Tennessee. I remember when Bama and Tennessee wore crimson and orange for TSIO. I listened on radio to the Bama-Tennessee game where Tennessee played Rocky Top for the very first time (though I don't recall hearing it. Apparently it was played during halftime so I was probably out in the yard playing football.)

Damn, trying to lecture me about the history of this rivalry. To quote you, "Shut the fuck up."

[u/NimusNix → u/robotunes]

I'm so sorry, but it makes me happy this angers so many Alabama fans. Rejuvenating, even.

[u/ScrofessorLongHair → u/NimusNix]

But Fulmer getting us on probation directly led to us being in position to hire Saban. It's like when you're walking down the street, stump your toe, then you look down and find a winning Powerball ticket on the ground.

You could say Fulmer snitching on Bama was the greatest thing that's happened to Bama in my entire lifetime, possibly ever. So thanks, ugly colored homie.

[u/NimusNix → u/ScrofessorLongHair]

The blessing in disguise.

[u/ScrofessorLongHair → u/NimusNix]

It was worth every single Mike.

[u/Alabamac820 → u/Rnorman3]

They could have. They just chose not to, because we ain't a bunch of bitches.

[u/Garfunkel_Oates → u/robotunes]

First of all, fuck Philip Fulmer. Second of all, if y’all cheated, y’all cheated. Third, fuck Bama.

[u/robotunes → u/Garfunkel_Oates]

Cheated: Yes

Snitched: No

[u/Garfunkel_Oates → u/robotunes]

Every true Vol fan knows Fulmer was a snitch when he fucked over Johnny Majors… I’m not sure what kind of dunk you all have always thought this is.

[u/robotunes → u/Garfunkel_Oates]

I knew Fat Phil screwed over Johnny Majors but what did he snitch about?

I. hate Tennessee but had a soft spot for Majors. He got royally screwed out of a Heisman.

[u/NimusNix → u/Garfunkel_Oates]

Fuck Bama should really be the first of all.

[u/FlyinJimElbows]

Love the hate. I’m always so excited to play you guys and keep the rivalry alive even though we’ve been pretty low for quite some time now (recent matchups aside). Wasn’t the death penalty put in place on you guys earlier than 02 though? For some reason I remember it being mentioned often when I was a kid watching Fulmer coach in the 90s.

[u/robotunes → u/FlyinJimElbows]

Near-death penalty was February 2002. Bama appealed. In September 2002, the NCAA rejected our appeal and upheld the sanctions.

[u/FlyinJimElbows → u/robotunes]

Ah I see, appreciate it! See yall Saturday

[u/Intelligent_Dress347 → u/FlyinJimElbows]

Bama was mired in sanctions for most of the late 90s and early 00s.

[u/FlyinJimElbows → u/Intelligent_Dress347]

That’s probably what I’m thinking of then. During our Peyton era (the first I was old enough to watch and understand) Bama was struggling, and more than a few people were mentioning how the NCAA had basically neutered them.

[u/SirTiffAlot]

While I love dogs, I do appreciate someone not being a dog person

[u/jtezus]

Fuck pumpkins, just can’t sit with that color

[u/Epicapabilities]

It's that puke in a pumpkin orange

[u/Hilldawg4president → u/Epicapabilities]

It's not that orange that you can sit with...

[u/kris0203 → u/Epicapabilities]

And I don’t like pumpkins.

[u/Revolutionary_Elk791 → u/Epicapabilities]

The kind of orange you see at a garbage truck driver convention.

[u/majorvol]

Allegedly

[u/robotunes → u/majorvol]

Court documents show Fulmer twice called NCAA staffer Rich Johanningmeier, who was probing alleged wrongdoing at Alabama in 2000, and gave him information implicating the Tide in rules violations

[u/majorvol → u/robotunes]

"According to a lawyer for two former Crimson Tide football coaches."

If the calls did take place, perhaps Fulmer just called Rich explicitly about the probe into Tennessee?

The idea that the NCAA would completely sweep Tennessee violations under the rug just to takedown Bama.

At the behest of the Tennessee head coach.

Who was under his own probe... idk

[u/84020g8r]

I think it’s even more than that - it’s the way Tennessee operated for years. Tennessee is the school that demanded that Florida give up their 1984 sec championship. It was won on the field under the then current rules. Tennessee, after the fact, initiated the vote to change the rules and strip the title.

Google summary below:

The Southeastern Conference (SEC) stripped the University of Florida of its 1984 football championshipthrough a 6–4 vote by the conference university presidents on May 31, 1985. [1]

Key Events Leading to the Stripping
NCAA Violations: Head coach Charley Pell resigned three games into the 1984 season after an extensive NCAA investigation uncovered 57 to 59 major rules violations. [1, 2, 3]
The Infractions: The violations included illegal recruiting practices, a $900 unearned payment to a prospect, booster ticket inflation, and loaning money and cars to players. [1]
On-Field Success vs. Probation: Led by interim coach Galen Hall, the Gators finished the 1984 season with a 9–1–1 record (5–0–1 in SEC play), beating Kentucky 25-17 to claim the school's first-ever conference title on the field. However, because of the pending NCAA investigation, Florida was already barred from participating in a bowl game (the Sugar Bowl, with LSU going instead). [1, 2, 3]
The Presidential Vote: On April 3, 1985, the SEC executive committee initially voted to let Florida keep the title. Following heavy lobbying from schools like Vanderbilt and Tennessee, the full SEC university presidents overturned that decision on May 31, 1985, voting 6–4 to strip the title and leave the 1984 SEC championship vacant

Edit: spelling

[u/robotunes → u/84020g8r]

They low-down.

[u/Why29206]

I hate 10Rc, and so should you!

Fuck that McRib too.

[u/wahoo20]

So, what you’re saying is, because of Tennessee the Saban era Bama becomes a reality and absolutely elephant stomps everyone for almost two decades?

[u/mmps901]

2nd violation

[u/GoldFingerSilverSerf]

Everybody paid players. SEC schools were doing it better than anybody. Fulmer definitely snitched but it was bullshit they were coming down on anybody in particular to begin with. Might as well be Bama, imo. That’s just how this shit goes y’all.

Anyone here feel bad for Alabama?

[u/Andrewh2012 → u/GoldFingerSilverSerf]

They should! We’re in a severe natty drought /s

[u/Irreverant77]

We snitched on ourselves for Mc Donald's bags. Bammers brag on the radio about poisoning trees. We are not the same.

Fuck Bama

[u/catptain-kdar → u/Irreverant77]

Bama fans don’t claim Updyke dummy

[u/Irreverant77 → u/catptain-kdar]

He made it to middle age wearing Walmart bama apparel for some strange reason Einstein.

It isn't that deep, though. It's a joke. Try not to drown face first.

[u/Adams5thaccount → u/Irreverant77]

As a neutral party Alabama was pretty fuckin universal against that one. Even Paw! was immediately like what the fuck did you do.

[u/UncleFlip → u/Irreverant77]

Chick Fil A

[u/MaskedBandit77]

I don't like Alabama, and I have no particular ill will towards Tennessee, but that guy was spot on about Tennessee's orange being the worst possible shade of orange. It's not that orange that you can sit with.

[u/ModsEmbezzleMoney]

Nobody personifies Tennessee better than Randall from Recess

[u/theurbandragon]

Nice to get a good historical perspective

[u/Healer1124]

"rogue Bama booster" As if everyone wasn't doing this under the table. lol

[u/robotunes → u/Healer1124]

Bama was under sanctions and had told boosters to cut that shit out for a while. Logan Young didn't. When the AD found out what Young had done, he made an example out of Young to show other boosters and the NCAA that Bama was taking this seriously.

[u/Healer1124 → u/robotunes]

That's interesting. I didn't know that bit of history. I just assumed everyone of that era was getting paid under the table.

[u/GlennQuasar]

I’m a Yankee so I don’t have a dog in this fight, but something that young man said was right on the nose. It is NOT the kind of orange you can sit with.

[u/ThrowRA_looking]

And then bama started paying everyone off. The rest is history

[u/Neophyte12 → u/ThrowRA_looking]

This would hit a little harder if the start of this story wasn't your team being investigated for cheating

[u/ThrowRA_looking → u/Neophyte12]

lol. Cash in McDonald’s bags Is a classic

[u/catptain-kdar → u/ThrowRA_looking]

That was your coach not Alabamas

[u/TripSufficient9316 → u/ThrowRA_looking]

the irony of a tennessee fan crying about paying players when their whole 90s run was built on a booster literally bragging to the ny times about breaking rules is something else

[u/spiralout1123 → u/TripSufficient9316]

If they could read, they’d be furious

[u/tider06 → u/spiralout1123]

Some of 'em CAN read words.

The comprehension part still eludes them, though.

[u/spiralout1123 → u/tider06]

Tennessee fans comment with voice to text

[u/NUTS_STUCK_TO_LEG → u/spiralout1123]

These kinds of chirps don’t really work coming from Bama fans

[u/StFuzzySlippers → u/TripSufficient9316]

Damn, I forgot everyone else was broke in the 90s apparently. Poor little ole Tennessee was the only school paying players? Man sell that shit somewhere else.

[u/Rnorman3 → u/TripSufficient9316]

And here I was about to comment on the OP - the irony of a bama fan complaining about Tennessee snitching. Both teams were paying players and bama would have done the exact same thing in our shoes.

[u/dustyg013 → u/Rnorman3]

We don't complain about the paying of players in that era, we complain about the snitching

[u/Rnorman3 → u/dustyg013]

Which says a lot about

[u/dustyg013 → u/Rnorman3]

I mean, we knew we were paying them. So was everyone else. It is breaking the gentleman's agreement that we had problems with.

[u/muttonchops215]

Why is there a backstory. Fulmer snitched on Bama because they were too cheap.

[u/FuckMississippi → u/muttonchops215]

when alabama put out an arrest warrant for the old pumpkin i knew it was getting serious

[u/CombatRedRover → u/muttonchops215]

I mean, Fulmer was always a scumbag, but so was Bama in this situation.

Scumbags hating on each other for being scumbags is always amusing.

[u/donkeykingdom]

So, Bama is corrupt and has been paying players more than other schools? 😱 Everyone in the Saban era knew that, the only question is why was he so good at it and everyone else couldn’t keep up?

[u/dankenascend → u/donkeykingdom]

Bama did a great job of pivoting to gray areas. $0 down, 0% interest, no payments for 5 years on electronics and clothes and cars and trucks and things that go. Money handed out after graduating or getting drafted. Hook-ups on social events and apartments. All of it available to players and immediate family.

Definitely still impermissible benefits, but ones that didn't have a paper trail while they were enrolled. NCAA doesn't have subpoena powers, so can't look at the vehicle in-house financing. They just started using the Auburn and Florida method instead of the Tennessee and Kentucky method. (We pivoted in the mid-90s.) The best thing about that pivot is that you could get players on credit with a $50k car note hanging over their head if they don't act right.

[u/donkeykingdom → u/donkeykingdom]

Bama did not keep a three-deep of five stars in the Saban era because Saban was/is a charismatic fellow 😂

[u/catptain-kdar → u/donkeykingdom]

When nil started as a thing saban kept players for less money than they could get elsewhere. Maybe it had something to do with his connections and other attributes and was less about money

[u/WarriusBirde]

A wonderful Snitchmas-eve to those that celebrate and a joyful fuck the Vols to you and yours.

[u/dawgfan19881]

If Bama wins tomorrow it would mean Tennessee will almost certainly go the entire 21st century without winning the sec championship game.

[u/RTR7105]

Walked right by at the SUB when this was filmed.

[u/Podoboo322]

This rivalry has way more juice than Alabama and Auburn.

[u/robotunes → u/Podoboo322]

Alabama alumni in the state go ernment tried to close Auburn. 

The two schools played each other anyway until a dispute broke out over the amount of playeds' per diems and over who would ref the game. 

That minor disagreement halfed the rivalry for 40 years. It took an act of the Alabama legislature to force the schools to play again. 

I'm old enough that my parents' generation remembers when the two schools refused to play each other, so the Auburn hate was MUCH stronger then than it is now. It was so strong that Alabama's first regular-season game on national TV was the Iron Bowl, not Tennessee (whom se also hated, just not as much).

There's more than enough hatred to go around haha!

[u/Midnightstimepasser]

Backstory: Brother just hated Tennessee.

[u/_Reporting]

TLDR bama got caught cheating and accuses Tennessee, without evidence, of snitching and while also accusing us of cheating and the NCAA just let’s Tennessee slide

[u/robotunes → u/_Reporting]

Court documents show Fulmer twice called NCAA staffer Rich Johanningmeier, who was probing alleged wrongdoing at Alabama in 2000, and gave him information implicating the Tide in rules violations

[u/no_god_pls_noo → u/robotunes]

You don’t deserve the downvotes. College football - and especially SEC football - is nothing without its real housewives style drama.

[u/senschuh]

NCAA thought about death penalty, but then remembered it's Bama and punished them less than they did Ole Miss.

[u/Intelligent_Dress347 → u/senschuh]

You’re shitting me. They tried to bury Alabama 10 feet under. 

[u/JBR1961 → u/senschuh]

Or Mizzou

[u/Johnny_Kilroy_84]

Damn sounds like a couple of programs that should have been kicked out of the conference