r/CrappyDesign • u/ACE_Wrap • 1d ago
Krefeld (Ger) likes putting these very subtle edges in their sidewalks. Almost tripped over them twice in one day.
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u/sartoriallyspeaking 1d ago
I don't see the problem. The lip differentiates the sidewalk from the bicycle lane.
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u/66tofu-nuggies 21h ago
The problem is the low height of the transition. The fact that it’s so slight means a lot of people may not even notice a small step up while they’re walking. The transition should be higher so people will notice.
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u/ACE_Wrap 1d ago
Yes that's its purpose. Doesn't change its a trip hazard.
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u/ilumassamuli 1d ago
How would you trip if you didn’t go from the bike path to the sidewalk or the other way around? And why are you walking on the bike path? That’s much more dangerous than the chance of tripping.
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u/ACE_Wrap 1d ago
You see it's at a traffic light/crosswalk? You're absolutely supposed to walk across this thing.
Sometimes it helps to just look at the picture and think before you type your response.
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u/ilumassamuli 1d ago
Did you cross where there is no edge? I’m not sure where the tactile paving tells visually impaired people to cross, but if they are pointing in the right way, that is a problem of the tiles, not the edge which safely separates pedestrians from cyclists.
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u/Dandylion71888 21h ago
I can see the depth even in the photo. Maybe go to the eye doctor?
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u/ACE_Wrap 17h ago
Now think you're coming from the higher side. Think you didn't read the title where you're told to look for an edge. Think you're distracted by your phone or by traffic, by looking at storefronts or whatever, or by talking to someone who's with you. Think about the edge being obscured by fallen leaves or snow perhaps.
Think about basic human behavior instead of looking at a picture such as it is and treat it like you were some bot.
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u/Dandylion71888 10h ago
They’re different colors and textures! Also, being distracted isn’t an excuse or make it crappy design, it just makes it crappy human.
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u/ACE_Wrap 10h ago
It's a sidewalk, not the cockpit of an fucking airliner. Not the place to require perfection from people. Humans should be allowed to look somewhere else every than at the ground in front of them every now and then. Nobody expects a ledge in the sidewalk, especially not in the one place where you're expected to cross it when everywhere else there isn't one.
If there was some kind of curb between the walking and cycling lanes along their entire length and here that's interrupted so you can cross easier, that would make sense. Not the other way round.
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u/Dandylion71888 9h ago
Notice the downvotes? Just accept that you’re the crappy one here and move on.
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u/scfoothills 1d ago edited 1d ago
This is good design. It keeps pedestrians, cyclists, and cars separated and slows cyclists and cars down.
Edit: You can Google "raised bike lanes krefeld" and find articles about this project. I'll admit I'm relying on Gemini a bit because I don't speak German and the articles I tried to translate were behind paywalls. Still, this is something cities all over the world have been doing a lot of recently.
-1
u/Goblinweb 11h ago
Aye, there's a reason why we prefer to have different heights between pedestrians and vehicles. It's very easy for pedestrians to wander into a lane for vehicles when there aren't height differences.
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u/ACE_Wrap 1d ago
Don't judge a design if you clear have no clue how it works, how the place looks like.
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u/CeIIsius 1d ago
You only trip on this if you walk on the bikelane. Don't walk there. However, the bikelane could definetly be indicated more clearly.
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u/ACE_Wrap 1d ago
It's a crosswalk, you HAVE to cross it.
Also think of cyclists getting to close to the edge, grannies with pushtrollies...
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u/proudly_not_american 1d ago
Looks like it goes down to be level where you're supposed to cross. So cross properly and it's not an issue.
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u/Helpful_Ganache_2098 19h ago
Man muss schon seine Füße heben. Und eigentlich ist das für Blinde wie dich gemacht 😄🤏
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u/Rojokra 14h ago
So I'm an infrastructure planner and this is literally a regulation barrier-free sidewalk. The reason for the edge is so people with impaired vision can feel it with their sticks. Notice how it is also painted in a bright white that contrasts the road surface? It's literally designed so that people with very bad vision can still see it. OP seems to be tripping over infrastructure that is literally designed to be easy to see.
The reason for the lowered part right next to it is to make it easy for wheelchair users btw.
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u/veevoir 13h ago
Serious question - should the tactile/guiding tiles for blind people be at the very edge where all those surfaces are so close? I would imagine it would be better to be on the other side of the sidewalk to minimize the risk that even when using guidance - a person is not walking partially on the bikelane or is at risk of walking down that curb?
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u/Rojokra 5h ago edited 5h ago
So in this image, there already is an edge on the other side of the curb, followed by grass, so tactile elements are not necessary there. The blind person would follow that edge, until they come across the tactile elements, which indicate a crossing. They can then choose to cross the road, in which case they would follow the elements until they feel the white painted edge and then wait for a crossing signal, or they would continue along the far, grassy edge.
We assume some degree of familiarity with the area, so we plan for someone who walks there regularly, not someone who walks there for the first time in their life. The goal is not to navigate for the blind person because that's usually impossible in road areas - rather, we just want them to know where everything is, so they can safely navigate themselves. So it is usually fine to indicate where the safe area ends, because they will then use that knowledge of their space to keep an appropriate distance.
Ideally, you would have a full wayfinding system comprised of tactile elements, like there are in many train stations. However, the mixed modes of transport in road areas usually make that impossible or extremely costly and difficult, so those are generally only build in pedestrian-only areas.
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u/R3d5t0n3_GUY Well… they’re not wrong… 1d ago
That’s gotta be dangerous for blind people 😬
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u/Goblinweb 11h ago
Not knowing if you're walking into a lane for vehicles is probably a lot more dangerous.
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u/Kurt_Ehrlich 14h ago
It's designed to include the needs of disabled persons. On the right you have no curb with tiles going across, this is for bikes and wheelchairs. On the left you have a higher curb and contrasting tiles for visually impaired people. The edge is for a tactile stik so blind people can feel where the road starts/ends. The tactile tiles there indicate the direction of the crossing. Because it is with a traffic light the tiles with the knobs go right to the front indicating cars have to wait otherwise there would be a gap of two tiles. On the back of the sidewalk there is also an edge a tactile stick is guided at and blind people can follow.
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u/gabidanco 14h ago
Did no one see the guiderails for blind people leading to nowhere and indicating nothing?!? This is the most crappy part for sure in this pic
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u/Patentsmatter 13h ago
What I find concerning is the position and orientation of the striped versus dotted tiles. Shouldn't the dotted tiles indicate the obstacle and the stripes indicate the safe way to walk (and its direction)?
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u/OkPosition4563 13h ago
Looks like someone used up all their leftover materials to build this sidewalk.
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u/Chaosklaue 7h ago
What you can’t see in this picture is that these markings are a continuation of the ones on the other side of the street, where there is a tram stop. You would only trip over this edge if you weren’t paying attention or weren’t being sensible. Visually impaired people would actually be more likely to fall if these markings weren’t there. Unless you are walking straight across the street, you wouldn’t come into contact with this edge which separates the bike lane from the sidewalk at all. PS: I live nearby.
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u/halberdierbowman Comic Sans for life! 1d ago
The tactile pavement should make it obvious what's going on, but it seems nonsensical? All three look wrong?
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1d ago
[deleted]
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u/v0idness 1d ago
No, the giant round edge separates the road from the bike path and the rectangular edge separates the bike path from the sidewalk.
-12
u/Riddles_ 18h ago
you’re right, this is pretty terrible design. it relies really heavily on actually looking at the ground to see the curb, which blows for anyone with any sort of visual impairment, anyone with mobility aids, anyone using anything with wheels, and anyone who might happen to be looking at something else as they approach the crosswalk. the entire thing could easily be fixed with some yellow paint though
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u/Still-Bumblebee7 1d ago
surely that wont negatively affect anyone with 1)vision impairment or 2)who has literally anything with wheels with them at all!
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u/L30N1337 1d ago
"I don't see the problem..."
"wait, that's in the middle of the sidewalk, not the edge of it"