r/HistoryWhatIf • • 2h ago

Challenge: A realistic outcome of Confederate States of America victory.

10 Upvotes

I've watched many videos about a Confederate States victory, but all of these videos sometimes contradict each other.

So I'm asking what a realistic outcome of a CSA victory would be.

I'm not asking how they achieved it, that's up to you, but rather looking at the consequences: politically and culturally, both for the two Americas and for the rest of the world.

Finally, what would happen regarding the most prominent issue of the conflict: Slavery.


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 8h ago

What if Elizabeth II doesn't become queen?

8 Upvotes

I know that England does not have Salic law, but let’s assume that, following the First World War, women were excluded from the line of succession to prevent a foreign monarch—specifically a German one—from ruling the United Kingdom. The family, now known as the Windsors, accepted this measure in an effort to demonstrate their British identity.

The subsequent years unfold much as they did in our timeline: Edward VIII abdicates in favor of George VI. However, since George VI had no sons, the throne passes to Henry, Duke of Gloucester, in 1952, now Henry IX.

Thus, Henry IX reigns until his death in 1974. While William of Gloucester’s life would likely have taken a very different path, let us assume that he, too, dies without children, and Henry’s second son becomes Richard IV of the United Kingdom.

What would the United Kingdom be like today with another Richard on the throne? How would the public perceive his heir, Alexander, and the next in line, Xan?

On the other hand, what would have become of Elizabeth? Assuming she still married Philip, would she have converted to Orthodoxy? Would Philip have continued using his mother’s surname, Mountbatten, or would he have ended up opting for his paternal one?

Would Charles have married Camilla from the very beginning?


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 10h ago

What if Allies did not aid USSR in World War 2?

3 Upvotes

Thanks to lend lease USSR managed to turn tides of war, defeat Germany and become a hostile superpower, which was threatening western civilisation for half a century. Cold war also caused a lot of bloody wars (Korean, Vietnam and other), almost ended civilisation in likely nuclear exchange, and created such states as Pol Pot`s Cambodia, Mao`s China and North Korea, with extremely heavy human toll. Lend lease to yesterday`s enemy, knowing well that he will turn your weapons against you as soon as he recovers, had disastrous consequences later. No one could predict in 1941 that World War 3 will not happen because of nukes, after all.

Even without hindsight, would not it make much more sense for US and Britain not to prop up such hostile state as USSR? They were never on friendly terms - quite the opposite, Soviets wanted to take over the world in communists revolution (even though Stalin formally dismisses such a goal, he kept expandind and intervening, like Spain, wherever he could) and kill all capitalists. They also attacked and annexed independent states, just like Hitler. When war started, it soon became obvious that Germany will not win quickly and will get bogged down. So even without lend lease Germany was unlikely to take over entire USSR and its resources.

So what if instead of making communists stronger Allies waited (fighting only where is neccessary, like Africa, and starting bombing campaign, of course), while two sides exhaust each other? Since fight to death was inevitable, given how much they hated each other and how genocidal Eastern front was. And then bomb, nuke and defeat whoever is winning. Then no one would be left to keep threatening the world.


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 5h ago

What if Hickey Plot succeeded?

1 Upvotes

So what if the British Assassination or Kidnapping of George Washington succeeded in 1776?


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 10h ago

What if the Briton, Gaulish, and Germanic tribal societies were allowed to develop into the modern day?

0 Upvotes

I ask because Europe is so Rome-ified culturally. Art, government, symbolism, language, architecture, religion, etc. What would it be like if the modern societies of Europe derived these aspects of their culture more from their pre-Roman traditions? What can we speculate about how the arts, government (or lack thereof), symbolism, language, architecture, religion would have developed from their Gaulish, Germanic, and Brittonic cultures, and what this would look like in today's Europe?


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 1d ago

USA and China teamup!?

3 Upvotes

I apologize this is my first post here and I didn't know where else to discuss this thought experiment. But imagine let's say during ww2 after defeating japan the relationship between China and the US grows extremely. How would you think the world would be shaped if two powerhouses were two of the closest allies?

I would believe protection and technology would be way more advanced


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 23h ago

What if Gnosticism never existed?

2 Upvotes

r/HistoryWhatIf • • 1d ago

What if the holy roman empire colonized the americas before spain by 10 years

4 Upvotes

Would it thrive or fail?


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 1d ago

What if a global glacial period started in the 1820s?

5 Upvotes

OTL Dalton Minimum lasted from 1790 to 1830 and was a period of colder climate, what if it developed into the end of current interglacial period? From the 1820s, global mean temperature dropped at least 4 degrees in a few decades, making places like Moscow, Ulaanbaatar, Montreal, Qiqihar uninhabitable. Crop yield collapsed in Western Europe, North America, North China and Korea. It took hundreds of years for glaciers to expand to similar levels to Last Glacial Maximum.

Will this cause a refugee crisis as people rush to leave cold places? Will it change the dynamic between colonial powers and their subjects? I don't think this will cause the collapse of human civilisation as modern science and steam engine alread existed in the 1820s, but it will probably slow it down drastically. People probably had enough technology to survive but not enough to artificially reverse the new glacial period.


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 2d ago

What if Franz Josef was the one assassinated in 1914 instead of Franz Ferdinand?

29 Upvotes

Say he makes last minute plans to accompany Ferdinand on his state visit to Sarajevo, and gets assassinated in his place.

How would this change WW1 and the fate of Austria-Hungary when Franz Ferdinand immediately becomes emperor?


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 1d ago

What if Aceh break up with Indonesia and join Malaysia?

2 Upvotes

How could it ever be possible? What challenges will they face? What advantages will Malaysia have?


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 2d ago

What if Lenin had lived longer?

25 Upvotes

Lenin was only 53 when he died and was in poor health for a long time.
What if he had been a health man, didn't smoke or drink and lived to the age of 63, 73, or 83 and stayed sharp minded?

Would he stay in power? He would be around for the Winter War and WW2, would that had been different?

I understand he didn't trust Stalin, would he somehow rid of him?


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 2d ago

What if Indonesia's Communist Party coup succeeded and took over Indonesia, what do you think Indonesia will be like today?

16 Upvotes

r/HistoryWhatIf • • 2d ago

What would Scotland look like if the Darien Scheme was a rousing success

36 Upvotes

In the late 1690s the then Kingdom of Scotland tried to establish a colony in what is now Panama.

It was an unmitigated disaster. 80% of the colonists died. And bankrupted Scotland.

It probably led to the Act of Union, which led to the British Empire.

What would the world and Scotland look like if Darien was a success?


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 2d ago

What if the Trinity test blew a hole in the ozone layer?

14 Upvotes

Those familiar with the history of the atomic bomb would likely know that before the Trinity test, Teller, Oppenheimer and Compton were worried that the atomic bomb would set off a self-sustaining nuclear reaction that would burn through the atmosphere and end all life on Earth.

These fears would prove to be unfounded, but what if they were partially right?

What if instead of destroying the atmosphere, the Trinity test blew a hole in the ozone layer in the atmosphere above New Mexico?

For the purposes of the scenario, let's assume that the damage to the ozone layer cannot heal itself and gradually worsens between 1945 and 1965.

How would the United States respond to discovering that its first atomic test had caused a global environmental catastrophe? Would atmospheric nuclear testing be prohibited? How would this affect the Cold War, the environmentalist movement and the Space Race?

What would everyday life look like in New Mexico? Would people gradually adapt to living under a changed sky or would the entire state become uninhabitable? What happens to the other states in the American Southwest?


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 2d ago

What If Bacon’s Rebellion succeeded?

2 Upvotes

I understand Nathaniel passed from illness which damaged the progress but what if he survived and continued the battle? How would that shape American culture and race politics?


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 3d ago

Which war did the wrong side win?

365 Upvotes

I don't want to hear any bullshit about ww2 (unless thats your honest opinon you sick fuck)


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 3d ago

What if the interior of Australia was lush instead of arid?

8 Upvotes

In our world, the interior of Australia is a vast desert and over 90% of the continent's population lives on the coasts. But how might the continent's history have played out of the interior had forests and plains instead of a desert? Might some great civilization comparable to Egypt or Mesopotamia have risen up?


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 3d ago

If Muhammad Ali’s Egypt had managed to cement its separation from the Ottomans, could they have lasted as a regional power in the ensuing decades?

5 Upvotes

Could an actually officially independent Egypt, as opposed to the de facto autonomy of the period, have actually existed? At least until the Europeans start eying the Suez, or dreaming of a Cape to Cairo railroad? Both examples are British but interest in the region may change in this scenario.

One of the bigger hurdles that Im aware of is that this would significantly weaken the Ottomans, thereby undermining the stability of the region, and perhaps more importantly, their use as a pawn in local affairs for the major powers. An independent mega Egypt may be a counter weight to the Ottomans, but Im not sure such a thing would be necessary.

If they were a useful tool for matters in their own region though, that might give them a better chance. Also an alliance or guarantee from a major power COULD help, but they are unlikely to do such a thing without expecting something in return. Like a protectorate deal for instance.

Anyway, those are my thoughts on the matter, but I’m not very familiar with much of these topics and would like to get some input from who is.

*If you can’t tell I’ve been playing Victoria 3 as Egypt, and wanted to know more about if the Oriental Crisis and such had played out differently.

**Im typing this on mobile so sorry if this has poor grammar.


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 3d ago

What if Juan Pujol Garcia died before World War 2?

6 Upvotes

Okay, so I'm prefacing this with, the Nazis lose the war anyway, we all know that, this is just more of a "I wonder if one small change could have made major changes to the war?" question. And I came to one name.

Juan Pujol García.

If you aren't familiar with him, he's a Spanish man who decided in World War 2, he wanted to help the Allied cause. So he went to the British embassy and asked if he could help out. They said no.

So he said, no problem, I'll do it myself. (But probably in Spanish.) Man creates a fake identity as a fanatical fascist. Goes to the Nazis. Says he wants to help them out. They say, absolutely, go to Britain, start spying for us.

He moves to Lisbon. Collects travel guides and train schedules and newsreels and magazine ads about Britain. Starts spinning fantastic bullshit to feed the Nazis. Anyone who knows Britain would recognize he's lying. The Nazis think he's great. Tell him to start building a spy network. So he starts making up names to create some imaginary spies. They've got backstories. At one point he says one of them died to excuse the delay on some news.

British intelligence, meanwhile, is hearing about the Nazis getting the reports from some network of spies hidden in Britain. Start searching furiously. Finally get their hands on the reports the Nazis are reading and... Realize this is all fake.

Short version is, the British find Garcia, bring him over to Britain, and he feeds the Nazis fake intelligence for the rest of the war- well, some of it's fake, some of it is true that is just delivered a little too late. It all leads to one conclusion: Germany loved him. Awarded him the Iron Cross for his service. Notably, to award the Iron Cross to anyone who didn't fight on the front lines required Hitler's personal approval. The service was, of course, over the radio. Meanwhile Britain loved him even more, for obvious reasons- four months after he got the Iron Cross, Britain named him a Member of the Order of the British Empire, one of the few people in the war to receive high honors from both sides.

Now, what I've rambled to here is: I've read speculation that the constant reports from Garcia helped the Nazis feel like they didn't need to invest more on infiltrating the British, so his counter-intelligence operation was incredibly effective, especially for something that started with a guy doing it all on his own initiative out of an apartment in Portugal.

So, it's obviously kind of an impossible question to really get to details on, but it's something to wonder about: What if he never started doing this? What if the Nazis didn't have this source for what they thought was reliable information in the UK, and made more efforts to infiltrate and spy on the British war effort?


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 3d ago

The Germans lose WW2 almost immediately

22 Upvotes

A series of skirmishes and provocations in Poland lead to the Russians declaring war on the Germans shortly after the British and French declare war.

Things go very badly for the Nazis and by early 1941 they're on the verge of collapse.

How does history play out from there?


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 3d ago

What if the Ottoman Empire succeeded in making their 10,000 pound donation to help the Irish during the famine? How would the scandal affect British-Irish relations and British-Turkey relations?

2 Upvotes

So according to a Ted-Ed video, during the Irish Potato Famine the Ottoman Sultan had planned to donate 10,000 pounds for famine relief. However, he was talked down to 1,000 pounds to avoid embarrassing the British Monarch Queen Victoria who had only donated a measly 2,000 pounds for famine relief.

But what if the Ottoman Empire had found a way to donate the other 9,000 pounds to help the Irish like through the Quakers who were providing humanitarian relief to the Irish however they could.

How would the scandal affect British-Irish relations and British-Turkey relations?


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 3d ago

What if austria joins NATO. 3 possible senarios.

11 Upvotes

austria was allowed to join the EU but not NATO to appease the ussr. what if they joined NATO for some of these senarios

  1. the ussr collapses in 1991 and they apply for it then. The agreement was with the ussr not the russian federation.

  2. the annexation of crimea made them break and join NATO.

  3. the hot war of russo ukraine 2022 spooked them to joining.

  4. when russia invaded chechnya. CAN choose between the 1st and 2nd chechan war.

  5. the russo Georgia war.


r/HistoryWhatIf • • 3d ago

3 alternate events that could have changed ww2?

7 Upvotes

Yes, we are beating the dead horse again. This is my opinion, these are the most “realistic” worst case for the allies/ best case axis events. (No Germany gets 9 billion wunderwaffen) played out in a domino fashion. I’m sure I missed things.

1. If Japan delayed and altered the Pearl Harbor attack Pearl Harbor by 1-3 weeks/ sent a 3rd flight.

In our timeline, Japan attacked on the day they did due to strict weather and moon constraints, as well as the weekend routines of the American military. In a massive stroke of luck, none of the 3 Pacific carriers that were scheduled to be docked were actually there. If Japan had managed to hold off by even just one to two weeks, it could have resulted in some or all of the carriers being sunk, which would have severely crippled USN air power from day one.

To make a bad situation worse, the fear of a USN carrier counterattack famously caused Admiral Nagumo to cancel a planned third wave. In this timeline, that fear would be completely eliminated, making a devastating third flight entirely viable. This third wave would have targeted Pearl Harbor's 4.5 million barrels of above-ground fuel, the main repair dry docks, and the submarine facilities. Wiping these out fulfills Japan's ultimate goal of annihilating the fleet and rendering Pearl Harbor completely non-functional.

It would force a total US retreat to the West Coast, giving Japan invaluable time to consolidate its Pacific gains. Consequently, the Battle of Midway, which we historically won by a razor-thin margin thanks to a lost bomber squadron stumbling onto the Japanese fleet, would be completely disrupted or never take place at all.

2. U-110/U-559

In our timeline, while the Kriegsmarine was incredibly destructive to shipping, the cracking of the enigma code and later tech allowed the allies to continuously monitor and predict the submarine fleet and effectively neutralize them, allowing the US to supply Britain with necessary materials and Russia with lend lease.

However, this entire intelligence apparatus relied on the narrowest margins of luck and a couple of frantic boarding actions. The first massive breakthrough happened in May 1941, when British sailors boarded the sinking U-110 and captured an intact Enigma machine and standard naval codebooks. Later, when Germany introduced the advanced four-rotor Enigma machine in 1942, the Allies went completely blind for ten months. This second devastating blackout was only broken because British sailors boarded the sinking U-559 and managed to throw the new codebooks out to a waiting boat before the submarine went under.

If the German crews on either U-110 or U-559 had successfully thrown those lead-lined codebook bags into the deep water, Bletchley Park would have remained locked out of the naval codes. Allied supply lines would have collapsed under the weight of uncontested U-boat attacks. Great Britain would face starvation, and the vital Lend-Lease trucks, fuel, and planes destined for the Soviet Union would be sent straight to the bottom of the Atlantic.

3. The axis powers capture Malta

In our timeline, the tiny island of Malta was one of the most strategically vital locations in the world. Often described as an “unsinkable aircraft carrier”, it sat directly in the center of the Mediterranean Sea.
Because British submarines, bombers, and warships were based there, the Allies were able to intercept and destroy Nazi and Fascist supply convoys heading to North Africa.

General Erwin Rommel famously noted that without Malta, the Axis would end by losing control of North Africa.

However, Malta came incredibly close to falling. While the Axis drew up a massive joint invasion plan codenamed Operation Herkules to drop paratroopers onto the island, they did not even need a bloody amphibious landing to take it. By the summer of 1942, Malta was effectively neutralized by heavy bombing and a brutal naval blockade. The island was completely starving, out of aviation fuel, and running out of ammunition. Top-secret British communications reveal that the military command had already set a definitive target date for surrender in the first week of September 1942 simply because human life on the island could no longer be sustained.

Malta was saved by the narrowest margin in history during Operation Pedestal in August 1942, when a heavily damaged oil tanker was literally towed into the harbor while sinking. If the Axis powers had successfully maintained their blockade for just three more weeks or managed to sink that final tanker, Malta would have been forced to unconditionally surrender due to starvation. This would have turned the Mediterranean into an exclusive Axis lake, allowing Rommel's Afrika Korps to receive an uninterrupted flow of supplies. Rommel could then easily crush the British defenses at El Alamein, capture Egypt, and seize control of the Suez Canal, cutting Great Britain off from its quickest maritime connection to its empire in the East.

The Final Timeline

When these military disasters converge, they trigger a catastrophic cascading failure that completely shatters the conventional Allied war effort by 1943. The entire conflict transitions from a battle of industrial production into a war over resource survival, which the Axis powers successfully monopolize.

The Western Allies are immediately paralyzed by a total fuel crisis. Great Britain has virtually zero domestic oil production on its home islands during this era, making the empire entirely dependent on overseas imports. With the Atlantic turned into a complete naval death trap, the critical tankers carrying oil from the Americas are systematically hunted down, strangling the British war economy. Simultaneously, Axis forces seize the Suez Canal and drive straight into the Middle East. The British forces, completely starved of imported fuel and reinforcements, are easily overwhelmed. The Axis powers successfully conquer the massive oil fields of Iraq, Iran, and Saudi Arabia, securing a virtually limitless supply of petroleum for the German war machine while stripping the British Empire of its primary lifeline.

This Middle Eastern victory opens up a devastating, completely undefended southern flank into the Soviet Union. In our timeline, the Red Army survived because the United States kept them alive via Lend-Lease, shipping millions of tons of logistical supplies. In this timeline, those routes are cut off. The German armies launch a massive pincer movement, moving north through the Caucasus mountains to capture the Baku oil fields, which historically supplied over 70 percent of the Soviet Union's fuel. Starved of native oil, stripped of Middle Eastern resources, and completely cut off from American logistical support, the Red Army's mechanized divisions freeze in place.

The Soviet military infrastructure undergoes a total operational collapse, allowing the Wehrmacht to capture Moscow, Stalingrad, and Leningrad by late 1943, forcing the fractured remnants of the Russian population to retreat past the Ural Mountains into an indefinite, decentralized partisan guerrilla war.

The Holocaust

With the Soviet Union shattered and a Western D-Day landing rendered completely impossible due to the closed Atlantic, the Nazi regime is left with absolute, unhindered control over the continent. Because the war lines freeze into a territorial stalemate, the Nazi apparatus is given the time, geography, and total privacy to complete its industrialized genocide.

The death camps in occupied Poland and Russia operate completely uninterrupted for years, successfully wiping out the European Jewish population. Furthermore, because the Axis successfully conquered Egypt and the Levant, the SS mobile killing units deploy directly into the Middle East. The historical Jewish populations of Palestine, Egypt, and Iraq are entirely swept up into a newly constructed network of regional death camps, completely erasing them from the region.

Atomic Annihilation

In the Pacific, the war becomes a vastly longer and bloodier logistical nightmare. Because the U.S. Navy was forced to abandon Hawaii and pull back to California, the island-hopping campaign is delayed by two full years while the U.S. builds an entirely new navy from scratch. When American forces finally push back out in late 1944, they find a Japanese Empire that has heavily fortified every single island outpost. Casualties for American troops skyrocket into the millions.

Despite these massive conventional defeats, the United States still possesses the Manhattan Project, which yields operational atomic bombs on schedule by 1945. With no nearby staging grounds to launch conventional land invasions in Europe or Asia, the U.S. military adopts a doctrine of continuous, systematic nuclear coercion. Operating from airbases using remote outposts , the U.S. uses long-range heavy bombers such as the B36 Peacemaker and B29 to continually bomb Germany and Japan.

They systematically drop atomic weapons on Japanese and German cities, military hubs, and industrial centers as fast as production allows, month after month, on a regular manufacturing schedule.

This unrelenting atomic bludgeoning produces two completely different results. Total geographic isolation, combined with a strangling American naval blockade and the complete vaporization of its major cities, causes the Japanese military hierarchy to completely fracture. Facing absolute societal extinction, Japan surrenders its entire overseas empire and withdraws entirely to its home islands to survive, turning the Pacific Ocean into an uncontested American lake.

In the Europe, however, the campaign results in a permanent standoff. While Berlin, Frankfurt, and the Ruhr Valley are systematically reduced to radioactive ash, the Nazi military apparatus is spread out across thousands of miles of conquered territory. Because the U.S. cannot occupy Europe with bombs alone and Germany cannot cross the Atlantic, both sides are forced to sign an incredibly tense, uneasy truce. By the late 1940s, the globe is cleanly divided into two heavily armed spheres of influence, initiating a dark and unstable Cold War.

The Internal Collapse of the Nazi Regime

Ultimately, the Nazi Empire is broken not by American military invasion, but by the fatal structural flaws of its own ideology. The Nazi state is fundamentally a predatory war economy that relies entirely on a continuous cycle of territorial expansion, resource plundering, and the theft of foreign wealth to artificially sustain its massive domestic expenditures.

Once the borders of the empire are permanently frozen by the threat of American intercontinental nuclear retaliation, the plunder stops. Without new nations to conquer and rob, the financial architecture of the regime disintegrates.

The staggering economic burden of maintaining a multi-million-man occupation force, combined with the catastrophic, bleeding costs of fighting that endless, brutal Russian partisan guerrilla war, completely bankrupted the empire from within. Deprived of international trade with the Americas and suffering from systemic corruption, the Nazi war economy stagnates into absolute bankruptcy. Over the following decades, the regime undergoes a violent internal fracturing, eventually collapsing into civil war and regional chaos under the weight of its own unsustainable tyranny.

An Alternate 2026.

The global landscape of 2026 is a stark, highly fractured planet defined by a fragile multipolar nuclear standoff and deep historical scars. The geographical boundaries forged during the late 1940s truce remain largely intact, but the ideological and cultural landscapes are fundamentally transformed. There is no interconnected global economy or unified internet; instead, the world is split into heavily guarded regional trading blocs, where international diplomacy is dictated by sophisticated anti-ballistic missile grids and the permanent fear of intercontinental destruction.

The Western Hemisphere and the Pacific Ocean exist as a massive, hyper-technological coalition anchored by the United States. Because the U.S. spent the twentieth century in a permanent state of high alert against a hostile Eastern Hemisphere, American society developed into a vigilant garrison state. While democracy survived, it is heavily militarized, with a cultural identity deeply rooted in national defense, domestic resource independence, and absolute naval dominance over the Pacific Lake. Japan, restricted to its home islands since its mid-1940s defeat, exists as a deeply insular, highly automated nation, permanently rebuilding from the scars of the American atomic campaign.

Across the Atlantic, the formal Nazi Empire has long since collapsed under the weight of its own unsustainable war economy, leaving behind a chaotic jigsaw puzzle of competitive nationalist successor states, military juntas, and radicalized insurgencies. Continental Europe, North Africa, and the Middle East are locked in a series of localized, brutal brushfire wars over the remnants of old Axis infrastructure. Because the Holocaust was completely successful within Europe and successfully expanded into Palestine during the 1940s, the modern cultural and demographic landscape of the Middle East and Europe contains a permanent, tragic void. The radioactive ruins of cities like Berlin, Tokyo, and Frankfurt stand as overgrown, empty monuments to the brutal atomic campaigns of the twentieth century, serving as a constant reminder of how close the world came to absolute annihilation.