r/RomanceLanguages • u/antonius_8 • Aug 30 '26

Lemnos Stele

https://www.academia.edu/172469861/The_Lemnos_Steles_Balkan_Romance_Language

An Italic/Romance translation of the Lemnos Stele.

0 Upvotes

50% Upvoted

32 comments sorted by

1

u/Specialist_Cup3221 Sep 02 '26

Here is a much more convincing argument that doesn't need to manipulate the syllable structure to fit into the analysis like you do. They also back up their claims with previous works and evidence. Lemnian was not an Italic Language, but an Indo-Aryan one, which also makes more sense geographically. https://www.researchgate.net/publication/370872405_Lemnian_an_archaic_form_of_Etruscan

1

u/antonius_8 Sep 02 '26 edited Sep 02 '26

Those translations make no sense. You do not have the intellectual capacity to understand our paper. We present a comprehensive, line-by-line translation. Structurally, the entire text operates cohesively as a fluid highly sophisticated and emotionally raw reproachful funeral dialogue-dirge, strictly adhering to the official, established epigraphic transcription. The core methodological breakthrough of this paper lies in how we treat the graphic text. Rather than assuming every visual word-block on the stone represents a single, isolated lexeme, we analyze them as rhythmic phrase clusters and phonological fusions that occurred in the spoken language. The boundaries established by the original punctuation remain completely untouched. We segment the text strictly within these existing blocks. And we are showing that the same writing system is on the church inscription of the Saint George-Lozonschi church. It’s beyond your comprehension, amateur.

2

u/Specialist_Cup3221 Sep 02 '26

If you have to insult to make your argument, it means that your argument is weak.

Rather than assuming every visual word-block on the stone represents a single, isolated lexeme, we analyze them as rhythmic phrase clusters and phonological fusions that occurred in the spoken language.

Do you have recordings or anything to prove that the rhythm is that which you propose to be? Making such assumptions from a single fragment with words that are essentially hapax legomena and without even bringing previous works that demonstrate it is just scientific malpractice.

No wonder you are an "independent researcher", lol, I doubt anyone takes you seriously.

1

u/antonius_8 Sep 02 '26 edited Sep 02 '26

I didn’t insult you. Where is the “insult”? You can’t even give arguments. evištio = e vi, știo ‘he is alive, I know it’, toverona = to vero, na? ‘this (is) the truth, no?’. It can’t get more Italic than that. marasm avis aomai ‘you hear the withering in (our) soul’. fokiašiale = fok ia ši ale ‘the fire/pain/sorrow even takes away our roaming’ = Romanian focul ia ši hoinăreala. maras mav ‘you destroy (our) vigor’, maras ‘you destroy’, from PIE *merh2-, mav ‘vigor’, from PIE *meHw-, cognate with Latin moveo, momentum, Luwian muwa (power). A true Balkan Italic language, as I have demonstrated. Your translations do not even have Greek words. Why are there no Greek words? My translation has Greek words: ale (roaming) in fok ia ši ale. marasm (withering), sero (hero).

If the words CUAGIUTORIUL: LUIDUMNEZEU: ZIDITORIUL: ATOATE reads not cu agiutoriul Lui Dumnezeu, Ziditoriul a toate, in Romanian, then tell us what they mean. Come on. Translate cuagiutoriul as a single word, luidumnezeu too. Do that if you can:)) the archeology of the Lemnos Island is only THRACIAN and GREEK. Lemnos is close to Thrace.

1

u/platitor_cas Sep 04 '26

Sounds like a bunch of amateur bullshit. Like the tartaria "decipherings", lmao

1

u/Specialist_Cup3221 Sep 04 '26

Read the paper I linked. You'll see that you are wrong.

1

u/antonius_8 Sep 04 '26

Since you can’t give the whole translation, I’ll give you the Etruscan one:

A: holaies: naφoθ: siasi:
maras: mav
šialχveis: avis:
evišθo: seronaiθ
sivai
vanalašial: seronai: morinail
aker: tavarsio
B: holaiesi: φokiašiale: seronaiθ: evišθo: toverona
rom: haralio: sivai: eptesio: arai: tis: φoke
sivai: avis: šialχvis: marasm: avis: aomai

A: for holaie, the nephew of siasi
magistrate mav (4 years?)
60/40 years
evištho in seronai
lived
of the vanal family, seronai in Myrina
aker, [the son of] tavarsio
B: for holaie of phokias, in seronai, evištho, toverona
when haralio lived, eptesio made this in phokae
lived years 40/60, and magistrate [one] year, [then] he died.

This is the verbatim Etruscan translation.
But there are also other ones….

1

u/Specialist_Cup3221 Sep 04 '26 edited Sep 04 '26

So you do say Lemnian is just Etruscan, therefore not Indo-European, then, as it is clear that it is not Romance or Latin or Italic. Also, now you give an accurate transliteration of the Etruscan text found in the Lemnos stele inscription, but you didn't in your original translation, why?

If you already knew the Etruscan translation, then I fail to see the point of your original post. Unless you happen to be just a troll, of course.

1

u/antonius_8 Sep 04 '26

No, I just gave you the translation from the Etruscan perspective. I gave mine from an Indo-European (Italic) perspective.

1

u/antonius_8 Sep 02 '26

A: si (day) a (by) si (day) maras (you kill) mav (vigor)
ši (and) alx (distress/grief) veis (you see)! avis (you hear)? e (he is) vi (alive), štio (I know it)! sero (hero), nai (you have not) ti (you) si (daily) vai (woe)?
holai (disaster) es (IS)! na (not) poti (was/were) a (in) ker (sky) tavar (bull) sio (god),
vanala (nourishment goddess) ši (and) al (sun god)? sero (hero), nai (you have not) morinail (grumbled/muttered)?
B: si (daily) vai (woe) avis (you hear) ši (and) alx (distress/grief) vis (you see)! marasm (withering) avis (you hear) aomai (in soul)! rom haralio (chieftain), si (daily) vai (woe) epte (directs/guides/sends) sio (god) a (to) rai (heaven) tis (your)! pok (fire/pain/sorrow) e (is)! holai (disaster) e (is) si (daily)! pok (fire/pain/sorrow) ia (takes away) ši (even) ale (roaming)! sero (hero), nai (you have not) ti (you) [si vai] (woe daily)? e (he is) vi (alive), štio (I know it)! to (this) [e] (is) vero (truth), na (no)?

A: 'You destroy/kill [our] vigor day by day and you see [our] distress/grief! Do you hear?
He is alive, I know it! Hero, do you not have woe daily? There is disaster! Were the bull god, the nourishment goddess and the sun god not in the sky? Hero, have you not grumbled/muttered? B: You hear [our] woe daily and you see [our] distress/grief! You hear the withering in [our] soul! Chieftain Rom, [our] woe guides/directs/sends the god to your heaven daily! There is fire/pain/sorrow! There is disaster daily! The fire/pain/sorrow even takes away [our] roaming! Hero, do you not have [woe daily]? He is alive, I know it! This [is] the truth, no?'

A translation that flows naturally.

1

u/Specialist_Cup3221 Sep 04 '26

Where do you get the meanings for each word? What sources do you use?

1

u/antonius_8 Sep 04 '26

Comparative linguistics, lol?

1

u/antonius_8 Sep 02 '26

I’m still waiting for you to translate “cuagiutoriul” and “luidumnezeu” as single words, if they do not read cu agiutoriul and lui dumnezeu:))

1

u/Specialist_Cup3221 Sep 04 '26

These two words do not appear in the text. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lemnian_language?wprov=sfla1 This just shows without a doubt you are just another crank.

Give me a heads up when you will have "deciphered" Linear A.

1

u/antonius_8 Sep 04 '26

You didn’t read my paper. Look at figure 5, I’m showing there a Romanian church inscription, which is written in the same system as the Lemnos stele, with multiple words glued together or which can also be called “aerated scriptio continua”. You will see that the Romanian cu agiutoriul lui dumnezeu, ziditoriul a toate (with the help of god, the creator of all) is written as “cuagiutoriul: luidumnezeu: ziditoriul: atoate”.
You see cu agiutoriul (with the help) written as cuagiutoriul. As if I would write in English withthehelp, or Italian conl'aiuto instead of con l’aiuto. Do you understand? So I’m proposing that the Lemnos Stele is written in the same system, which is similar to AERATED scriptio continua.
So I read Lemnian siasi as three words glued together, namely si a si, which I translate as “day by day”, where Lemnian “si” (day) = Romanian zi (day), Lemnian “a” (to, at, by) = Romanian a (to, at, in), Spanish a (to, at, by). Spanish dia a dia (day by day). Lemnian maras as a second person singular verb meaning “you destroy”, from PIE merh2-e-si (you destroy). Lemnian mav meaning “vigor, life force, power” from PIE meHw- (to shake (forcefully), cognate with Latin moveo, momentum and Luwian muwa (power). The semantic evolution from ‘to shake’ > ‘power, vigor’ is natural as seen in Latin momentum and Luwian muwa.

So Lemnian siasi maras mav reads si a si maras mav and translates as ‘you destroy [our] vigor day by day’. The inscription opens not with praise, but with a jarring accusation delivered directly to the deceased. In ancient reproachful rituals, the
community treats the leader’s act of dying as an aggressive, ongoing betrayal. His absence is a weapon that inflicts a crushing toll, actively draining the physical strength and life-force “vigor” (mav) of his survivors day by day.

The scribes also ask the deceased one “avis?” (do you hear?), from PIE h2ew-ye-si (you hear).

marasm avis aomai (you hear the withering in [our] soul). marasm (withering) is borrowed from Greek marasmos. avis (you hear). And aomai (in the soul) is a dative-locative noun as the ‘ai’ shows, from PIE *h2ew-m-o-, cognate with Old East Slavic umu ‘mind, soul’, Lithuanian aumuo ‘mind’.

phoke must be read as phok e (there is fire), where Lemnian phok (fire) = Romanian foc “fire”, and e ‘is’ = Romanian e ‘is’.

In the archaeology of the Greek island of Lemnos prominent "fire trails”, specifically extensive ash layers, charred destruction horizons, and burned architecture, provide stark material evidence of the Persian invasion during the late 6th and early 5th centuries BC. Understood? You literally cannot deny the fact that I managed to give a translation through the Italic language family, you can only deny just because you want so, or because you support another translation.

1

u/Specialist_Cup3221 Sep 06 '26 edited Sep 06 '26

I read the document, and the Romanian church inscription, whose source you don't cite, so it might as well be fabricated by yourself, is not written in Etruscan/Lemnian.

The thing that you seem to cling onto to make your whole argumentation, the scriptio continua, was also used to write Greek, Latin, etc. Indo-Aryan languages were and are also written in continuous scripts: Brahmi, Avestan, etc. So the Indo-Aryan article I linked, which you have not read, is much more plausible. You just aknowledged the fact that there was Persian presence on the island:

In the archaeology of the Greek island of Lemnos prominent "fire trails”, specifically extensive ash layers, charred destruction horizons, and burned architecture, provide stark material evidence of the Persian invasion during the late 6th and early 5th centuries BC.

The fact that you keep contradicting yourself with every comment just shows that you don't (want to) know the trith and prefer to push some unfounded nationalist agenda.

QED

1

u/antonius_8 Sep 06 '26

Who said the Romanian church inscription is written in Etruscan? Wtf? It is about the writting system: multiple words glued together. Learn English. Your article is nothing, it does not give a translation. Wtf dude the Persians came later and conquered Lemnos, which was inhabited by the Sintians, a Thracian people. Whatever makes you sleep better at night, you don’t understand anything🤣

1

u/antonius_8 Sep 06 '26

This is not scriptio continua, but AERATED scriptio continua, which is not used in any Aryan text.

1

u/antonius_8 Sep 06 '26

The church is literally called the Saint George-Lozonschi church, what is wrong with you?

1

u/antonius_8 Sep 06 '26

Why won’t you give the whole verbatim translation?

1

u/platitor_cas Sep 04 '26

A paper is supposed to be simple to understand to convey its message and convince the reader.

1

u/antonius_8 Sep 04 '26

My paper or his paper? I analyze each line one by one, and then I give the verbatim translation in parentheses. It’s very simple and clean.

1

u/platitor_cas Sep 04 '26

Yours.

1

u/antonius_8 Sep 04 '26

Dacă nu te duce capul, n-am ce să-ți fac. Ești clujean😃

1

u/rongspeled Sep 02 '26

Bullshit.

0

u/antonius_8 Sep 02 '26

That’s what you have in your brain. Plora, barbare!

1

u/rongspeled Sep 02 '26

Lol, typical Balkan nationalist. You need to steal the language and history of civilised Rome because you lack your own.

-1

u/antonius_8 Sep 02 '26

As a Romanian I have more connection to Rome than you will ever have🤣

1

u/rongspeled Sep 02 '26

The fact that you won't answer is proof that you are just another fraud.

0

u/antonius_8 Sep 02 '26

And where are you from, what is your name???

-1

u/antonius_8 Sep 02 '26

The thing is you can’t give any arguments, barbarian.