I don't think it really works like that though. If she is found not guilty by reason of insanity, she goes to a psychiatric hospital but she will constantly have the opportunity to be released if she is found to not be suffering any mental illness anymore. Prison is the only guarantee she will not be released to the public. If she is released by the hospital NOTHING is stopping her from having more children.
People held in psychiatric facilities after being found not guilty of a violent crime due to insanity end up staying there for much, much longer than their prison sentences would have been.
Please show me the proof on that, because I recently learned of Abdulloi Toshpulodzoda, a man who murdered another man, was found not guilty by reason of insanity, was sent to a mental hospital but was authorized 48hr releases into the public, he chose to flee the country in his authorized release.
These hospitals don't just put someone in a straight jacket and lock them away. The goal is rehabilitation, and if they are deemed rehabilitated they are given privileges like weekend releases, or even a full release.
I've been in both for work. If you were sane, you'd rather go to prison for life. And if your loved one was fucked in the head you'd want them in the state hospital.
Edit to add: Prisons release people too early sometimes, too.But the state hospital requires the board and a judge to release people, a higher bar.
It is absolutely not a cushy outcome. She’d likely be in the facility for the rest of her life. I’m a lawyer, I see this play out in real life, but here’s a decent article about it.
Wherever is more hellish, and guarantees she is kept from the public, send her there. I don't fucking care. I don't want to spend the better half of my morning debating over a bitch who murdered her children.
Where she goes should be determined during sentencing. Having a not guilty verdict, for any reason, during a murder trial is even more insane than she is.
It would be not guilty by reason of insanity, commonly shortened to NGRI. Rulings like that are very rare to actually get and a large portion of the people who get them end up serving more time than they could legally be sentenced had they just plead guilty.
NGRI means the person did it, but they weren't in a state of mind where they could be held accountable. The attempted assassination of Ronald Regan is probably the most famous modern NGRI case.
You seem to not understand how much scrutiny goes into an NGRI plee
The burden of proof is completely flipped from the prosecution to the defense
I know nothing about this case in particular, but if 11 out of 12 members of the jury agreed with an NGRI plee, then there must have been a very strong case for it
Lol yeah, sorry I tried to edit that comment and just made a new one. I believe you are correct here.
I honestly had no idea the burden of proof was still on the state in Massachusetts. This is honestly probably how it should be everywhere considering how much we generally pride ourselves on considering people "innocent until proven guilty" despite how often the public seems to disagree with that sentiment.
No worries. Insanity defence is a weird one. You basically admit you did the crime, but that you were not responsible due to mental state. I agree with many who have proposed it should be guilty but insane, which would change the sentence to a minimum time in an asylum instead of minimum time in prison. Currently the minimum time is only like 6 months across the board (of course you need to pass some unspecified test to not be a risk to society anymore)
Cant edit my previous message because of how far down we made it (the edit button got squished). I don't know anything about massachusetts law, I assumed this was a federal case but I could be wrong. As I said before, I don't really know much about this case and I already know more than I'm interested in tbh
I personally still don't want psych workers exposed to actual murderers, however. I'd rather they spend their time and limited compassion on people who haven't already ended a life.
Social worker here. I've worked with many NGRI clients released from forensic psych centers. I once worked with a young man who killed his sister during his first psychotic break. He was one of the most genuine and hardest working clients on my case load. He was full of remorse. It tore him up inside, what he'd done. He stuck to treatment like it was his job, while a lot of my clients, even those not involved in the court system, couldn't give half a fuck. He said he could never forgive himself, even though his family had, and he wanted to do every damn thing he could to make sure he never hurt anyone else again. That young man deserved my compassion. Psychotic disorders are complicated.
It's called not criminally responsible and if she goes to a psychiatric facility she either is never getting out or spending basically her entire life there.
Are we worried she's going to get out and murder more kids?
Which is why I don't understand the point of this going through a jury. If she's genuinely insane (as in couldn't understand what she was doing) a jury of random professional couldn't be able to actually tell and sending a mentally unwell person to prison goes against the spirit of the law. On the other hand, she could easily trick them with some empathetic bs since they aren't trained psychology professionals and a dangerous person could be again released to the public. I don't think a case that revolves about something so technical should be left to the interpretation and feelings of some random people
The jury doesn’t examine and diagnose the defendant - both the prosecution and defense put up expert witnesses who have done that and testify to their findings. The jury has to determine which expert is more credible.
It's even more insane that the jury, and her defense attorney tried to get the lone juror removed because he did not come to the same verdict they believed was right. I genuinely just can't believe 11/12 came to a not guilty verdict after countless psychologists testified that she was NEVER INSANE TO BEGIN WITH. When I read public opinions online it's like we all watched two completely different trials, I genuinely believe the prosecution proved beyond a reasonable doubt that she was not insane. The calculation it took to do what she did, the planning, only telling certain people certain thoughts and not anyone who would actually report her. I just can't believe it.
he wanted him remove because he said that while he doesnt believe the prosecution proved she was sane beyond reasonable doubt he will still declare her guilty
Wrong. They tried to get them removed because they said ”yeah there is reasonable doubt but I don’t care, Guilty”. And that’s not the job of the jury. People in America have basically no understanding how our legal system works and what they do know they get from TV shows lol.
The jury was provided testimony from expert witnesses from both sides. Suffice to say, it's clear the state was failing in its burden to prove culpability beyond a reasonable doubt. Even without the defense witnesses, state's witness had only treated two cases of post-partum psychosis, acknowledged a lot of her case was consistent with psychosis, but just didn't agree with the final diagnosis
There needs to be a minimum added to cases involving claims of insanity. If the judge could attach “in a psych ward for an absolute minimum of 30 years” to her sentence, I think more people would be on board with the plea.
Yes lmao, what kind of question even is that? Did we forget what she did? How many times she did it? How she reacted afterwards? The second she could communicate again she wanted a lawyer she didn't ask about her kids or her husband, she wanted to cover her own ass.
The lawyer part is still the most insane to me and I’m surprised nobody talks about it. Nothing wrong with lawyering up, but right after strangling your 3 children is insane. Especially because she only mentioned “hearing voices” after consulting her lawyer
There’s a particular cruelty in a system that withholds help from those in crisis but goes out of its way to make sure they are lucid enough to be punished.
Nobody withheld help. She was doctor hopping, wouldn't follow their treatment plans, checked herself OUT of inpatient, and did not use the resources given to her by the suicide hotline. Like the prosecution said, she wanted help, but on her own terms.
I don’t think you believe Lindsay is a danger to your children. I don’t think this is about the children, at all. If it was, society would be trying to fix the postpartum crisis. Society would be repairing the social safety net by funding programs to help new parents.
Burning Lindsay at the stake isn’t going to stop women in crisis from harming their children. But go off.
It is still possible, she didn't damage her reproductive system and shes not old enough to be in menopause. Paraplegic women can still have children, it's just higher risk.
Ok, but she was never considered to be in a state of psychosis until after the murders. All of the psychiatrists who treated her testified that she was not in a psychosis state during her visits. They don't even think she is in a psychosis state now. So that would mean she would be up for release after the 40 day Massachusetts minimum holding period, if she was found not guilty by reason of insanity.
Once the insanity ceases (which has already happened since the mirders were 3 years ago and she's been cleared by doctors), there's nothing to treat, so she'd be free.
Those places don’t actually eliminate the risk of these people to kill again or have another mental break. Sure, they might lower it, and sure, it might be lower than punitive justice. But it’s still way over the risk of an average person killing someone and/or mentally snapping. The idea that mental hospitals will just fix people right back to normal is the biggest psyop ever. I’m sure it works great for lesser crimes. Not this.
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u/-SecondHandSmoke- Sep 07 '26
I don't think it really works like that though. If she is found not guilty by reason of insanity, she goes to a psychiatric hospital but she will constantly have the opportunity to be released if she is found to not be suffering any mental illness anymore. Prison is the only guarantee she will not be released to the public. If she is released by the hospital NOTHING is stopping her from having more children.