Any Avid S3 users here?

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While I don’t use this one, but usually if you back up the drivers they will keep working. Windows is great at backwards compatibility. Cubase allows you to build a control script for any surface, so I wouldn’t expect problems there.

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u/mattiasnyc 14d ago

Cubase allows you to build a control script for any surface, so I wouldn’t expect problems there.

Surely this depends on the protocol, no? Otherwise people would have been using the old Digi controllers with Cubase and Nuendo in the past.

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u/meirone 14d ago

The default protocol for the S3 is EUCON; other than that it can also “speak” Mackie and HUI.

All three protocols are supported by Cubase, so that’s not an issue hopefully.

And as for the comment about why don’t ppl use old machines…. Don’t look for answers that make sense. It’s purely consumerism….

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u/mattiasnyc 14d ago

Add: I emphasize I mean a more full support. Not "just" faders.

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u/mattiasnyc 14d ago

The default protocol for the S3 is EUCON; other than that it can also “speak” Mackie and HUI.

All three protocols are supported by Cubase, so that’s not an issue hopefully.

Sure, I just meant that the other poster made it sound as if you could do stuff in Cubase to basically get "all" the functionality the controller has to offer, and that's not really the case. If the s3 has MCU/HUI capability then that's what you get, but not much more really (compared to Eucon).

And as for the comment about why don’t ppl use old machines…. Don’t look for answers that make sense. It’s purely consumerism….

That comment was really related to the above. If people could easily get any controller to work just because on the Cubase side we could " build a control script for any surface" then people would have bought up the Digidesign Icon for peanuts once Avid moved to Eucon, and used them as long as the hardware didn't break.

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u/meirone 13d ago

I wish I could agree with you that people purchasing habits are logical. I don’t think that’s the case with 99 percent of population. They buy the latest mostly because they’ve been told that it’s necessarily the greatest. Which is definitely something I can not agree with !

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u/mattiasnyc 13d ago

I don't think people behave rationally when buying in general. My experience however is that in the professional media production space people tend to be conservative, and since the controller is at the center of production it's a pretty important investment.

Of course PT users upgraded to Eucon devices once Avid took over and the older ones became end-of-life, what I meant was that the level of controller that the Icon was would have given it a great second life at "lower" parts of the market where they previously were too expensive and where there simply were no alternatives.

In fact, some users got together and wrote custom drivers for the Focusrite control 24, but it took some time and of course support isn't there any more. So several users snagged those controllers on the 2nd hand market because they figured it was great value.

If Cubase could have "fully" made all of those work then it'd have been a no-brainer for a lot of people to buy them. In other words, Avid moved on with PT making the older ones no longer get feature updates, so for PT users in the professional space it made sense to sooner or later upgrade to the s-series... because Avid moved on with PT.

If Cubase could have supported them directly it would have. I don't think it could. I don't think it can. That was really my only point. I just don't want people to be misinformed and come away thinking that they can just buy any controller and then all they have to do is fiddle with Cubase and it'll work just fine. That's not the way it works as far as I know.

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u/meirone 14d ago

Thank you That’s great news!!!

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u/Dr--Prof 14d ago

Windows is great at backwards compatibility.

Only in comparison to MacOS, which has aggressive vendor lock-in and planned obsolescence. Win11 is worse than Win10 in that regard, but luckily you can manually fix it in a way that you can't in MacOS.

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u/namedotnumber666 14d ago

I have an s3 and it works amazing with cubase. It also works with pt and logic and ableton ( as a midi ).
The only issue I have is that the new drum machine doesn’t appear on the surface. Send it to a group and it appears

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u/meirone 14d ago

Thank you Are you on PC or Mac?

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u/namedotnumber666 13d ago

im on mac.

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u/namedotnumber666 13d ago

I have just read the rest of the thread now and in support of the s3 i would say it integrates really well with cubase, there are loads of user keys that can be mapped to macros and key commands in the eucon software, I have mine toggle windows, close and open all plugins on selected tracks and zoom commands, you can also set of channel specific quick controls which are easy to get on the knobs,

All plugin parameters map to the knobs and so does all the inbuilt cubase channel strip parameters, I have concerns for the future as its now moving into unsuported territory, but because it speaks eucon it should still hopefully work for a long time.

I have friends who also have s3 and they have had issues with the led screens, i have not thankfully, but thats a weak spot to look out for.

Like any digital console you should give the faders a lubricate / clean with some faderlube.

Its also an AVB audio interface, if you are on mac it works with no drivers etc, it has monitor outs and a headphone.

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u/meirone 13d ago

Thnx

The plugin attached to the knobs is one my main reasons to choose it, as I do have plugins with more than 8 parameters.

I don’t have too much concern about the lack of support, and I agree with you that having it using EUCON rather than some unique protocol gives it some longevity. And drivers and software issues will act the a great motivation for me to stick to my current configuration and not be tempted to do unnecessary upgrades.

I’ve heard of the screen issues. I’ll just cross fingers as I need them for the plugin control.

Thank you for the detailed reply

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u/Visual_Ad_5450 14d ago

I use the softube console 1 fader, latest model. Works great and costs much less.

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u/meirone 14d ago edited 14d ago

The main issue made me skip Softube is that the mix is not saved on the Cubase project, and I don’t want to “marry” the Softube (or any other 3rd party) rapper.

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u/Accomplished-Plane72 11d ago

I'm not sure what this means? The mix is certainly not saved on the softube console. The Fader and pan settings are saved in Cubase, and the effects are saved in the console 1 plugins you put on each channel.

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u/meirone 11d ago

It means that in order to reopen a mix you always need to have Softube. You can not open the project on a computer that is not connected to softtube

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u/Old_Hamster_8633 11d ago

That’s partially true I guess? You’d have to have the plugins installed on the destination computer, but you would not have to have the hardware connected. But that is the case with any plugins.

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u/meirone 11d ago

As for what I read, the plugin information is stored on the rapper, not in the Cubase project

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u/Old_Hamster_8633 11d ago

No that’s not right. Cubase channel fader position, pan, mute solo etc, are all stored in the mixer settings in cubase. Softube settings (EQ, compressor, drive etc) are all stored in the vst plugin and saved along with the cubase project.

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u/meirone 11d ago

But if I use , for example, my UAD pulled plugin , or 1176 - where will it be stored?

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u/Old_Hamster_8633 11d ago

I think maybe you are confused about what the console 1 is. It’s just a controller for the native plugins it has compatibility with. No Audio passes thru it and no plugins run on the console 1 hardware itself. They all have to be installed on the computer, used in cubase just as you normally do, and the console 1 controls their parameters

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u/mattiasnyc 14d ago

Given that I have no plans to upgrade my Cubase 14 Pro, Win11 in the next three four years - do you think I can expect a smooth experience? Or am I expected to face troubles due to dated software?

My hunch is "yes". The s3 was originally a live controller and has sold a fair amount for studio use as well. Avid has been pretty good with support, and given that it's using the same protocol as the s1 I don't see why they wouldn't support it for another three years or more.

Of course, you could get two s1's instead. Fewer rotary encoders, same amount of faders.

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u/meirone 14d ago

Thanks!

I was about to buy 2 S1’s but then I realized that for less money and (almost) the exact same desk real estate I get MUCH more options, both in the form of another layer of knobs, and significantly more softkeys. Both would be very helpful with my attempt to put my computer keyboard aside, and hopefully (for mixing only) even switching my screen off.

And the little bonus of having those cute LED’s meters for each channel. Not a big deal, but I think it’s cool…

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u/mattiasnyc 14d ago

Yeah, I hear you. Having 16 faders arranged like that is very appealing. My personal experience though is that I'm using the tablet software a fair amount and with it the softkeys, which you have a massive amount of (key commands, macros, and more). Currently I use the softkeys on my s1 to switch between fader layouts and I think I would use more keys for transport if they were available.

Anyway, a lot of it comes down to what you do and how you prefer to do it. I do a ton of editing and fader rides and zero music creation. Plugin adjustments as well of course.

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u/meirone 13d ago

I was considering the iPad option, but as my goal is to go screen less when mixing, I prefer to have as much hardware as I can.

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u/mattiasnyc 13d ago

I hear you.

Just to be clear, I never use my tablet (Android) to control faders. Just to give one example of why I think you might find it useful (apologies if you already know, don't mean to be presumptuous):

I do post-production (sound to picture) and our mixes are nested into categories. Dialog has production dialog, ADR and narration. SFX has hard fx, foley, ambience and so on. Then it gets grouped into further categories depending on what the deliverable requirements are by networks; full mix, mix minus narration, music & effects, music (only), sfx (only), dialog and so on. We make extensive use of Group, FX and VCA tracks.

In order to navigate projects that easily have hundreds of tracks I use the Eucon "layouts". Clicking a button allows me to get all my main Nuendo mix faders on specific controller faders. For example first one assignable (by selecting in Nuendo), then in order the DIA group, DIA VCA, Mus group, FX group, M&E group, Mix Minus vca. Then I click another button and my faders are laid out SFX audio tracks 1-7 and then SFX VCA on fader 8.

But, I can also make that a macro, so I have a soft button that says "mix" which closes all folders in Nuendo, opens the ones I want to see, focuses the project on the main screen, opens metering plugins and video on the second screen, and recalls a controller layout.

That's just the one example. I have a page on my tablet for exports as another example. Export video, export audio mixdown, export EDL, marker track selection, auto-select specific output buses, and so on.

All of those buttons are in a grid with a ton of pages available.

If you have a large mix project I can almost guarantee you that you'll get a ton of use out of a tablet with Eucon without any of it being directly mixing on it. I have so many functions that I forget what menus they're in and what they're called so being able to customize pages, name the keys, color code them etc. is huge for me.

To each their own of course.

Sorry again if that was all obvious.

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u/meirone 13d ago

It's not about not wanting to mix on the tablet. It's about not wanting to look at any screen when mixing.

I'm a singer songwriter, and a music producer of singer songwriters. I'm producing very old school. 3 mics on the drums, less than 50 tracks per project. I used to mix on a real console back in the days, and I just want to get back to this feel. So the extra screen is not useful anyway.

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u/No_Connection3420 13d ago

I used an S3 in Cubase for a while. Cubase has really good EuCon implementation. The only issue I ever had with mine was when some faders started going out. I was able to order some new ones directly from Avid and the swap was super simple. My biggest and really only complaint was the layout of 2 rows of the screens. The way my desk was, it was impossible to read the top row without setting at a ridiculous angle. It does work well in Cubase though.

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u/meirone 13d ago

Tnx

Was the S3 located on the desk just in front of you? Or was it behind some keyboard?

I’m planning on having it the only thing in front of me, and the mouse - keyboard to the side of me. So I hope I have a good angle from the top

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u/No_Connection3420 13d ago

I had my Mac keyboard and mouse in front of me, then the S3. Though, I did have an 88 key controller under the desk, so my desk top was a little higher than a normal desk to start with which I know didn’t help.

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u/KeyElectronic1216 12d ago

Ive used the S8 , I found it quicker to use the M+K to be honest , just my personal work flow I suppose. 🤷

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u/meirone 11d ago

I actually see among the “big guys” some that are still preferring m&k, but for me it’s not necessarily about the speed (which I assume be similar to). It’s about wanting to switch my screen off

Any Avid S3 users here?

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