r/marvelstudios • u/KostisPat257 Daredevil • 21h ago
News Total minutes watched (US only) for Marvel Disney+ series that charted on Nielsen's Top 10 (January 2021-September 2026) - Loki and WandaVision are at the top, Wonder Man at the bottom, while Born Again never charted in the Top 10, across its two seasons
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u/Any-Way-8279 21h ago
Secret invasion having more views than born again..smh
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u/KostisPat257 Daredevil 21h ago
The marketikg for Secret Invasion was really good. The trailers were really hype, the comic story it was adapting was great, and of course it starred Fury and Rhodey, 2 OGs who people hadn't seen in a very long while and deserved their own outing. Plus, the first few episodes were really good, so it makes sense people would keep watching, keeping the show on the chartd. It only really started going off the rails in Episode 4.
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u/justafanboy1010 Spider-Man 21h ago
Yeah I remember everyone was hooked on the first episodes. I think cus Episode 5 and 6 really tanked and made everyone hate it in retrospect
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u/disneylegospider1 21h ago
5 was fine. A nice buildup to a promising finale.
6 however, is unquestionably one of the worst pieces of media Marvel has ever made.
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u/justafanboy1010 Spider-Man 21h ago
I’ll be honest the only thing I liked from the finale was Kingsley Ben Adir’s performance. He made me beleive he actually hated Nick Fury’s guts 🤣. (He played Gravik, the main Skrull Villain)
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u/disneylegospider1 21h ago edited 21h ago
Yeah, for all the faults of the show, Gravik as the villain wasn’t one of them. Good performance, motivations, etc.
But how they chose to deal with him, with Fury getting no closure with him and that horrid cgi super skrull battle, was a travesty.
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u/justafanboy1010 Spider-Man 21h ago
Yeah that was terrible but I liked his “Imma take a flamethrower to humanity” monologue so much
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u/Notimetowrite76 21h ago
Proof once again that a vocal group on the internet is not the same as real life.
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u/____mynameis____ Winter Soldier 20h ago
Agatha and Daredevil are the biggest but opposite examples.
Everyone and their mother in this very sub was asking who asked for Agatha spinoff ( which is dumb af question cuz most projects aren't made when people ask for it 🤦🏾♀️)
Yet it became one of the best performing shows on D+.( budget to viewership ratio. Iirc, it also gained viewers as weeks went on)
Daredevil had a massive campaign that brought him back yet its the worst performing MCU D+ show ever
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u/TheKingofHearts 11h ago
She-Hulk as well; it was derided online so much, but it was a tongue-in-cheek series not meant to take itself seriously and that clicked with the audiences.
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u/BZenMojo Captain America (Cap 2) 7h ago
She-Hulk is the only half-hour show at its level or above. Increase its minutes by 50%-100% and it jumps to anywhere from Top 4 to even above Loki...
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u/Second_City_Saint 15h ago
Wonder Man & DD also took place after price hikes. I watched them, just not on D+. The ridiculous cost is the problem they need to address.
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u/firedforthatblunder 21h ago
What do you mean by that?
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u/Agitated_Doctor1137 21h ago
They mean that just because a bunch of folks online feel very strongly about something, doesn’t mean the general audience shares the same sentiment
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u/kingofgamesbrah 18h ago
These places are echo chambers really. The people who come here (myself included) are the only ones who care about a particular thing. Ans even then its a lot of people
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u/Kgb725 21h ago
Yes but what is the deeper meaning
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u/jtides Spider-Man 21h ago
Daredevil isnt as popular as everyone on this subreddit make it out to be
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u/Xerxes457 21h ago
Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but wouldn't Wonder-Man charting mean its because it dropped all at once vs Daredevil being a weekly release? Ironheart had a weirder schedule but it released all 6 episodes within 2 weeks.
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u/jtides Spider-Man 21h ago
Sorry, i just meant that was the original comments original meaning. I’m not necessarily arguing for or against
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u/____mynameis____ Winter Soldier 20h ago
I mean Wonder man was also cancelled for low viewership. So Marvel has considered this logistics
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u/N8CCRG Ghost 21h ago
Interesting graphic, but since it's only including data from when a project was in a Top 10 it's only a rough approximation for how much something has or hasn't been watched. Other elements like "what else were they competing against at that time?" will affect these numbers.
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u/KostisPat257 Daredevil 21h ago
Oh for sure. DD is releasing at a bad time because it's competing with The Boys and Invincible.
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u/justafanboy1010 Spider-Man 21h ago
Shit, me personally I was watching all 3 of those back to back🤣. Daredevil on Tuesday then The Boys and Invincible on Wednesdays 🔥
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u/eriverside 20h ago
Used to be shows competed 1v1 due to dedicated time slots. There were shows for 3 hours a night, 5 nights a week.
I don't know where this narrative that having 4 shows throughout a whole year, each only 6-8 episodes (vs 24) is too much.
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u/natopoppins 21h ago
Wonderman was marketed so poorly. I’m an MCU fan and even I was like wtf is this? Then I watched it and was blown away. I hope they aren’t done with his character at the very least.
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u/justafanboy1010 Spider-Man 21h ago
I will never forget (it did just happen recently lol)
-In July 2025, for Fantastic Four, Yayha was at the premiere in character of Simon Williams on the red carpet and was even being asked about his movie Wonder Man.
- December 2025: Simon Williams and Trevor Slattery actors on actors type parody.
And that was it (the show came out January 2026)
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u/disneylegospider1 21h ago
https://reddit.com/link/ph8zhu6/video/to11dsaolyvh1/player
They marketed it plenty though? Like, it was the main thing Marvel was pushing right after Zombies and F4 came out on D+.
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u/justafanboy1010 Spider-Man 21h ago
Oh damn. I mean I remember some clips here and there in December and January but shit, that’s a lot lol. I guess people just weren’t interested in it. Sucks too, cause it was a really great show
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u/BZenMojo Captain America (Cap 2) 7h ago
They marketed it post-release. The day it premiered they didn't even announce it, the Roku app was advertising Daredevil Season 2 instead on both Hulu and Disney and was not telling people that Wonder Man came out that day, and in the weeks and months before there was barely even a mention. YouTube was basically an endless stream of Daredevil interviews and posts and people hearing about Wonder Man through word of mouth.
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u/disneylegospider1 7h ago
Most, if not all the marketing I showed was before release. They even gave it multiple trailers before release, with the first trailer releasing Oct 11 2025, over 3 months before release (while Daredevil’s first trailer was just 2 months before and released only after Wonder Man came out, and it’s only trailer before release). As soon as F4 hit Disney+ and Marvel promoted it for a bit, they immediately went into basically only promoting Wonder Man till release.
Disney marketed it plenty, people just didn’t have interest in it before release because it’s an unconventional superhero story with no superheroing, that too based on an obscure character.
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u/NewTribalChief 21h ago
Crazy how they fumbled Sam Wilson. Falcon & WS should have been a movie
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u/dalivo 6h ago
Yep. It could have been such an interesting buddy movie, with Sam the uptight by-the-book character and Bucky being the loose cannon. But they kind of screwed up the dynamic and the heroic aspects of Sam by having him be full of guilt and, at the end, having him express off-putting rectitude. And they added in "flag smashers" who were distinctly uninteresting as a villainous group. The dumb direction they went with this probably would have been curtailed if it had been a more tightly focused movie. That said, Brave New World came out much later and they didn't learn any lessons there about the fact that Sam was best as part of a duo.
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u/NewTribalChief 6h ago edited 5h ago
Right!
Sam should have gotten more exposure as Cap like pop up in Wakanda Forever. To go nearly 5 years since we last saw him is too long. Then again, for them to do all these movies with no Avengers team up unlike the previous phases is a headscratcher too. They waited too late to establish him as a leader
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u/SAM12489 15h ago
All this tells me is that Americans don’t like blind people or black people.
s/
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u/BZenMojo Captain America (Cap 2) 8h ago
Falcon and the Winter Soldier is in the Top 3, did you read the chart?
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u/spyczech 17h ago
It was good wym ?????
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u/OG_Felwinter Korg 15h ago
I think they’re saying more people would have liked/watched Brave New World if FatWS was a movie.
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u/Maatjuhhh 12h ago
Yeah it was basically a movie cut up in 6 parts. Some of the episodes doesn’t make sense as an episode itself (no building up or flow). However when viewed in it’s entirety, it makes sense. So does Moon Knight, however it’s premise fit the cliffhangers more.
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u/jmood88 11h ago
Wonder Man being beat by Echo is wild
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u/BZenMojo Captain America (Cap 2) 8h ago edited 7h ago
Echo is an hour-long show, Wonder Man is a half-hour. She-Hulk and What-If are also the other Half-Hour shows on this list... so basically increase their minutes by 50-100% to see their popularity more accurately.
Daredevil's an hour-long so nothing will save that.
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u/hey_you_too_buckaroo 3h ago
This is also around the time when Disney hiked rates and a lot of people quit the service.
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u/FelixTheJeepJr 21h ago
Ironheart also debuted in a feature before her show. I wonder how much of a difference that makes?
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u/KostisPat257 Daredevil 21h ago
Not only that, but they pushed Coogler's involvement in the show during the marketing and it was just after Sinners too, so he had a lot of traction.
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u/BZenMojo Captain America (Cap 2) 7h ago
Ironheart didn't even get marketing for the six months leading up to its release. Marvel went all-in on Daredevil and completely forgot the show existed until the day after its premiere. They didn't even release a YouTube video announcing it was releasing on the day it came out. If anything, Marvel was trying to bury Ironheart so Coogler couldn't demand more money by having his name attached to that and Sinners in the same year.
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u/icefire9 Valkyrie 15h ago
So if we assume every person watched each series' entire runtime:
Loki S1 - 22.8 million people
Wandavision - 15.5 million
Falcon and the Winter Soldier- 14.3 million
Loki S2 - 12.2 million
In comparison, its been estimated that 400 million people have seen Endgame in theaters. Brand New Day is close to 300 million people.
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u/KostisPat257 Daredevil 15h ago
Well this isn't really a fair comparison, because:
- This is US only numbers
- These are only the views during the weeks these shows charter at the top 10
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u/No-Strawberry-9301 13h ago edited 7h ago
beyond what that guy mentioned (US only and only counting while they are in the top ten), it also doesn't count piracy numbers, and TV is REALLY easy to pirate whereas with movies you'd need to wait for a digital release for a good quality version. Shows you can watch the day they release on another site
Edit: On Disney+ specifically it’s also legitimately better quality to pirate if you watch on a computer. Disney+ only allows up to 720p on computer, it’s actually ridiculous. That’s probably not as big of a factor for general audiences, but i felt like complaining because i always want to support the shows, but i also want to watch in HD (so at least for Marvel Zombies specifically I remember i did pirate cuz i want the animation crispy)
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u/justafanboy1010 Spider-Man 21h ago
Are all the live action shows up here or is one missing? Even the Secret Who Must Not Invade is up here
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u/KostisPat257 Daredevil 21h ago
I'm pretty sure everything's here. Apart from VisionQuest of course which just came out
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u/justafanboy1010 Spider-Man 21h ago
They did Wonder Man so dirty. Despite the image right in front of me, I somehow doubt Ironheart had more viewership than Ms. Marvel. From the way everyone talked about it, no one knew the show existed, no one cared for the show, it only ran for 2 weeks, etc.
And Wonder Man. You deserve better 🤦🏾♂️
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u/matty_nice 21h ago
That makes sense. They basically dumped Ironheart all at once, so those minutes were going to be more likely to be in the top 10.
Ms Marvel came out over a period of weeks, so it's only gonna count those episodes and minutes that were in the top 10.
This isn't really an accurate gauge of total viewership based on how it's counting the information.
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u/justafanboy1010 Spider-Man 21h ago
Ahh okay. That makes a bit more sense. Yeah since Disney+ never really reveals all the numbers, we can’t really know for sure
I had assumed tha t since Ms. Marvel was a weekly release, more (or less) people will watch it every week it came out
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u/matty_nice 21h ago
These numbers aren't great, but they are the only thing we really have. Lol.
Ms Marvel had 6 episode over 6 weeks. It only charted in the top 10 3 of those weeks, so only 3 of those weeks are counted. So if people watched new episodes every week, not all those minutes are counted.
The three weeks are Week 1, Week 5, and Week 6. So likely more people checked out the show for the first episode, the last episode (and binged). The 5th week was during July 4th, so possible more people had time to watch it.
That also probably indicates that a lot of people that checked out the 1st episode didn't continue watching it every week. Either they just quit watching the show or binged it at the end.
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u/justafanboy1010 Spider-Man 21h ago
Man this is really putting it into perspective for me. Thanks for the breakdown 👍🏾
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u/KostisPat257 Daredevil 21h ago
Actually, the fact that it was only 2 weeks might have brought more people on. Sometimes it's easier and more digestible to binge something rather than wait for weeks for it to finish. So people who saw that there were 3 available episodes right off the bat might have said "what the hell, why not?"
Still though, there's barely any difference between Ironheart and Ms. Marvel. The biggest surprise for me is She-Hulk charting for 7 weeks despite all the negative press it was getting. But I guess people liked hate-watching it.
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u/justafanboy1010 Spider-Man 21h ago
Never underestimate the power of hate watching haha. And the show was genuinely good too. I think my biggest surprise other than Ironheart is Secret Invasion but like you basically mentioned in your other comment, we didn’t know then what we knew now
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u/eriverside 20h ago
Secret invasion had bad writing but very interesting elements: super spy story thriller, Emilia Clarke, combined powers/super skrull, Sam Jackson, Rhodey... That's a lot of things going for it. Then they massacred it with the script.
I kept waiting for the payoff, fury was inexplicable... It ends in chaos and on the verge of civil war and the very next project - Marvels - completely ignores it, as do all other projects. Inexplicable.
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u/firedforthatblunder 21h ago
What only ran for two weeks?
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u/justafanboy1010 Spider-Man 21h ago
Ironheart only ran for 2 weeks.
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u/Bigbigbigrock 21h ago
But dropped in two batches, meaning it was less of a commitment, watch for two weeks or binge it in one
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u/Notimetowrite76 21h ago
I’d think part of it has to do with Sinners taking off in the spring. Coogler name recognition.
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u/moonlit-dreams9 11h ago
Agatha All Along landing right next to Secret Invasion is wild given how differently people talk about them.
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u/New_Transition5 10h ago
Also the fact that per episode cost of secret invasion is close too overall cost of Agatha All Along
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u/Beneficial_Cry2061 21h ago
What a suprise for Born Again.
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u/Uncanny_Doom Daredevil 21h ago
Part of it is certainly that people feel like they have to watch the original series to watch it. On the Daredevil subreddit this question happened hundreds of times over the past 18 or so months.
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u/Dana--- Captain Marvel 19h ago
Definitely. It’s sad to say but I think that’s part of the problem. As much as I love Netflix daredevil, it might’ve been better for the general audience if daredevil born again was a full reboot. If I hadn’t watched daredevil way back(and absolutely loved it,) I don’t think I would’ve found it in me to watch a whole three seasons before watching this.
But then again the parts from the soft reboot in season one weren’t very good so it’s not the only problem
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u/firedforthatblunder 21h ago
And people on here will still ask why Wonder Man got cancelled
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u/justafanboy1010 Spider-Man 21h ago
Quality doesn’t count if the views don’t add up
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u/Kgb725 21h ago
Yes they do.
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u/justafanboy1010 Spider-Man 21h ago
It doesn’t. There’s been a bunch of great quality television that gets canceled after 1 season only because 200 people saw it instead of 20,000 people
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u/anakmager Daredevil 21h ago
This is wild because imo Born Again and Wonder Man are the two best shows
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u/bluequarz 14h ago
Well there you go. That's why Disney is canceling Disney+ shows left and right and barely greenlighting any live action ones. The audience is no longer watching them
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u/kenncann 11h ago
I’m someone who stopped watching. I don’t have kids and Disney+ just wasn’t a good value to me if I’m gonna watch one show every 3-4 months. Switched to hbo when it was like $150/year. Just checked now and Disney+ no ads annual plan is $215. I am sure there are many like me who look at it like this
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u/hey_you_too_buckaroo 3h ago
I dropped Disney+ cause the service was crap, wasn't improving, but the price kept going up.
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u/KostisPat257 Daredevil 21h ago
Brad said Moon Knight was always supposed to be a one-off season and the character was supposed to be brought to the movies afterwards, probably referring to Midnight Suns.
But Blade's constant delays also indefinitely delayed Midnight Suns, putting not only MK, but the all the other supernatural characters' fates in a limbo.
Now the reason MK was only planned as one season was because Oscar Isaac didn't want to sign a multi-project deal with Disney again after his treatment in the Star Wars sequels.
They could have theoretically greenlit a second season when they saw that Blade was not getting off the ground, but practically, they already had too many shows in production at the time and Iger had just come in and stopped greenlighting any new shows until all their backlog had been released.
Remember that Zodiac is the only new show they've announced since 2022.
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u/OG_Felwinter Korg 16h ago
Why are Loki’s seasons counted separately and none of the others are?
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u/KostisPat257 Daredevil 16h ago
Probably because it charted for the whole run of both seasons and then some, so it would completely tramp the rest.
What if only charted for 8 weeks out of its whole 3-season run, so it's comparable with the rest.
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u/Waibashi 12h ago
You can see the ranking starts with the release date. As years go, you see the lower interest in Marvell, except maybe Loki because that was such a hit. Personally, I was tired of watching those Marvel series and I lost interest in them very fast.
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u/Matthew_murdock7 20h ago
General audience genuinely failed in recognising such a banger content like Daredevil born again. I'm so disappointed after seeing it's viewership :/
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u/bettyballoon 18h ago
But daredevil born again 1st season wasn't that well received at first? They reshot the season and then two stories/visions were sewn together and the result was weird. It was like they wanted to start fresh with new characters but regretted it half way and brought back all the fan favorites and did a tonal shift but then didn't commit to that as well. You sat there debating with yourself what concept you liked better, but overall it was very split personality. It wasn't the worst show but the Netflix seasons were just so much better. Second season might have been much better for a lot of people but trying to get back into second season was hard for me.. It felt like the time jump between seasons was there so the show runners could just discard what they didn't like about season one but that took me out of the universe. Well, I still haven't watched more than one or two episodes of second season. Again, it wasn't because it was terribly bad, I just lost all my excitement for the show having loved the Netflix run, and something else probably grabbed my attention at that time instead so I forgot about it. Still sorry it got cancelled for all the people to love the show.
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u/BZenMojo Captain America (Cap 2) 7h ago
Well received by whom? Brave New World was reshot because focus groups got annoyed that Thunderbolt Ross seemed like a mean parody of Trump. Sometimes the focus group destroys you.
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u/zach4499 12h ago
general audiences didn’t fail anything… Marvel failed to make banger content accessible to everyone.
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u/BlueMoon1795 13h ago edited 12h ago
The decision to kill off Foggy put me off watching Daredevil tbh, still baffles me why they made such a terrible decision.
Wonder Man was good but the marketing was kinda meh for it, I think the issue you’re seeing is that Superhero burnout was a real thing when Disney tried to force everything down our throats.
Probably a good thing they’ve scaled things back, enjoying Vision Quest so far, was a big fan of Loki, WV and AAA so I do hope they continue to make shows, they just need to stop listening to executives who have no fucking clue what they’re doing.
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u/colantor Steve Rogers 11h ago
Im in the minority, i know, but i was kinda done with foggy and karen. I felt like they werent adding anything to the show except annoying me for arguing with matt about every decision he made.
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u/Krimreaper1 Iron man (Mark I) 10h ago
The old showrunners did that and it was too late to completely change course. I think they could have just put him in a coma.
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u/eagc7 6h ago
Well its not black and white, as the issue is that the show started development as a reboot, with only Vincent and Charlie returning, so the show was shoot with a brand new cast to make the show feel distinct from the previous show and to not repeat what Netflix already did.
But the decision to keep the old shows canon was made far too late that they already shoot half of the season and they weren't gonna start all over again, so when the new showrunners came in and decided to keep the old canon intact, they had to figure out why Karen and Foggy were no longer part of Matt's life when we pick up with him in the show.
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u/cfbest04 12h ago
I watched a few episodes after Foggy was killed but I just could not get into it. Completely agree it was terrible decision and it hurt the show
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u/Krimreaper1 Iron man (Mark I) 10h ago
I was really upset, especially how they lauded the return of Foggy and Karen to only kill him 5 minutes into the show. I took a long time for me to settle into the show after that. But never forgave them.
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u/hapam0de 8h ago
Only speaking for Wonder Man, it sucks that the marketing was bad for for it considering how good a show it actually was. The action and writing were superb
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u/Data_Chandler 7h ago
The decision to kill off Foggy put me off watching Daredevil tbh, still baffles me why they made such a terrible decision
Same here. I must admit I never read any Daredevil comics, but I genuinely loved the character in the tv show, and the dynamic he brought in the Netflix seasons. So when I heard they killed him right away in the revival, I just couldn't be bothered to watch it. It's like someone asking you "Hey, you like this thing right? Here, I made it 30% less nice, do you still like it now?!" and the answer was just "Not really, so no thanks".
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u/eagc7 6h ago
Well the problem is that the show originally started as a reboot with only Charlie and Vincent returning with the supporting cast being a brand new cast
But because they decided at the very last minute to keep the canon of the old show that put a little issue.......we can't have Foggy and Karen anyway, because they were going to keep the old footage anyway.
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u/Ferbtastic 11h ago
I believe it’s because they shot the whole show as a soft reboot with only the main actor and kingpin returning. The rest of the cast was new. It didn’t do well so they did a bunch of reshoots. The entire first episode is basically new and they had to kill foggy because he wasn’t in the rest of the shot footage. The main girl is also only in specific scenes that were added later.
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u/jorgesalvador 19h ago
What is that one thing named “Secret Invasion” and why the fuck is there and not Daredevil.
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u/Ryguy-_- 18h ago
thats so disappointing that daredevil isnt even top 10. even if the quality hasnt been quite as high as the original netflix run, its still one of the best things marvel has put out. s2 of it is my favorite season of television of any mcu show (excluding the original daredevil run)
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u/capeasypants 18h ago
And charted here you will see the laws of diminishing returns in its full glory!
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u/RevenantRoy 20h ago
Whaaaaat. This can’t be right…. Something is missing here
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u/KostisPat257 Daredevil 20h ago
Nope.
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u/RevenantRoy 20h ago
Doesn’t make sense though. Born Again would not be getting a third season if it was received lower than Echo and Wonder Man lol. Even Wonder Man getting the initial renewal. Something’s throwing off what this data suggests in a way, someone mentioned something about it only tracking when it’s in Top 10 or something so that could be it.
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u/KostisPat257 Daredevil 20h ago
Yes. These are the minutes watched during the weeks that these shows were in the Nielsen Top 10.
For Daredevil, it just never charted, so we don't know its exact viewership numbers. It could theoretically be higher than say Ms. Marvel, but considering it did not chart, it's probably not that higher.
But then you have to consider other stuff like the competition at the time and why it did not chart and all that.
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u/RevenantRoy 20h ago
Ahhhh yeah, I get it now. You could certainly infer “something” from this data but it requires a lot of context and situational specifics lol.
It’s excluding any viewing minutes from the weeks when the show wasn’t in the Top 10 and doesn’t specify release schedule or over how many weeks, etc. etc.
So it’s something, but like a pretty skewed angle in terms of representing overall success or popularity of a show especially comparatively.
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u/-Hussain 21h ago
How in the hell is secret invasion, iron heart and she hulk here but not born again
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u/KostisPat257 Daredevil 21h ago
Because people did not tune in. Simple as that. Btw, it might have done better views than some of them, but it never charted in the Nielsen Top 10, which is why it's not here.
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u/eagc7 20h ago edited 19h ago
Yeah something we all have to remember is that alot of people started watching the MCU shows with WandaVision. If the same amount of people that started when the Disney+ shows came out had seen the old shows, there is a chance maybe Daredevil could've done better
But some fans were told for years and years that they didn't needed to see Daredevil and so on because either they weren't canon or weren't important to the MCU........but now they make a continuation of that show which is 100% firmly set in the MCU without any question of a doubt, so i can see alot of people that only started with WandaVision feeling intimitated by the fact they have to see the Defenders Saga if they don't want to risk missing important plot details and so on
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u/PurpleLord17 21h ago
So wait, Ms Marvel had better viewership than Daredevil? Given the way social media talks about both series, I’m really surprised.
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u/KostisPat257 Daredevil 21h ago edited 20h ago
No, not exactly. These are the minutes watched during the weeks that these shows were in the Nielsen Top 10. Ms. Marvel had even bigger numbers, but it only charted in the Top 10 for 3 weeks (Week 1, Week 5 and Week 6), so these are only the numbers it did during these 3 weeks.
It seems most people tuned in during the premiere, then kind of dropped it and came back during the last 2 weeks to catch up/binge the show.
For Daredevil, it just never charted at the top 10, so we don't know its exact viewership numbers. It could theoretically be higher than Ms. Marvel, but considering it did not chart, it's probably not that higher.
But then you have to consider other stuff like the competition at the time and why it did not chart and all that.
It's much more complicated than "Ms. Marvel did better than Daredevil"
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u/BoringWozniak 11h ago
That’s approximately release order, right? So maybe viewers/time would be a more useful measure…
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u/dalivo 6h ago
This is almost just chronological order. The earlier series had a huge bump after Endgame, and it's just slowly died since then.
The problem with most of these series is that each season isn't treated as it's own thing. It's always laying the groundwork for the next step, so they feel unsatisfying as stories. Only Loki and Hawkeye had really satisfying, fairly closed stories. Yet they don't greenlight a second second until the first is done, meaning it takes years for another season to come along.
They either need to commit to them being self-contained seasons, i.e., a mini-series. OR they need to commit to multiple seasons using a more procedural and episodic structure (big missed opportunity with She-Hulk and Daredevil both).
It's no wonder audiences are tuning out - why invest in these characters when they're treated like vehicles for the next movie or tie-in show, instead of their own thing? Or why invest in the shows when they're so uneven and unstructured?
1
u/Seekasak Heimdall 3h ago
Feel like this charts Nielsen's declining lack of relevance and accuracy as much as anything
1
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u/BorForYor 20h ago
These numbers are pretty close to useless. They’re a straight sum of the weeks that a show was in the top ten, so it’s mostly a chart of which shows had more episodes and weaker competition.
1
u/WoundedByInsults 20h ago
Due to the different release periods, this is not a fair overview. The longer a show is on D+ the more viewers it can attract.
1
u/newmclarens 19h ago
i think the takeaway is that people are resistant to new characters. there needs to be a tethering to what we know. daredevil is an exception, i presume because many may not have watched the preceding seasons which acted as a barrier
3
u/eagc7 19h ago edited 6h ago
Yeah i do think that since alot of people were told for years that Daredevil is not canon or that Daredevil is not important to the MCU, that they felt scared off because they had skipped the Defenders saga since they listened to those things and now we have a Daredevil show is that 100% without any question canon to the MCU and is a continuation of that same show they were told they could skip?
Yeah i can see that affecting Born Again
1
u/crepss 16h ago
This is it for me. I never watched the Netflix stuff because I was under the impression it was just gonna be retconned or that it wasn’t relevant to the main storyline but obviously that changed when they brought him back in Spider-Man and Born Again. Me being the completionist I am cannot just jump into season 1 of Born Again with nothing and that certainly doesn’t mean that I’ll just watch the first 3 seasons of Daredevil either. I am currently halfway through Iron Fist, working my way to Born Again and as much as I’ve enjoyed these shows it’s been a slog as well. I’d be curious to see what the viewing figures for all the defenders saga is since Born Again came out because I’d imagine there are others like me who want to get there but have a mountain 13 hour long episode seasons to get through first
1
u/No_Poet_1279 18h ago edited 15h ago
I don't watch daredevil, I don't like daredevil.
He's just a blind dude in New York with radar who beats folk up with sticks. I watch superhero stuff for the superheroic stuff.
Being grounded and gritty might be great for some people, but it ain't for me unless I want to watch something that's based in reality.
1
u/Ozryela 18h ago
The most noteworthy thing here is that this is almost entirely chronological. So in other words what this shows is basically the popularity of the Marvel Disney+ shows cratering.
For me personally that checks out. I was very excited for Loki and Wandavision, but started getting burned out on the MCU around the time of Moonknight and She-Hulk (not because of those particular shows, which were fine. It was just too much, and too many duds), and have barely looked at the most recent stuff. Wonderman was the only highlight in recent times, and that got cancelled.
And I've cancelled by Disney+ membership in the meantime, so that's 0 eyeballs from my going forward. I just couldn't justify the ever increasing cost anymore.
I still love the MCU but I guess I'm movies-only now.
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u/Fox_of_Cintra 12h ago
How did moon knight not get a season 2
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u/KostisPat257 Daredevil 12h ago
Brad said Moon Knight was always supposed to be a one-off season and the character was supposed to be brought to the movies afterwards, probably referring to Midnight Suns.
But Blade's constant delays also indefinitely delayed Midnight Suns, putting not only MK, but the all the other supernatural characters' fates in a limbo.
Now the reason MK was only planned as one season was because Oscar Isaac didn't want to sign a multi-project deal with Disney again after his treatment in the Star Wars sequels.
They could have theoretically greenlit a second season when they saw that Blade was not getting off the ground, but practically, they already had too many shows in production at the time and Iger had just come in and stopped greenlighting any new shows until all their backlog had been released.
Remember that Zodiac is the only new show they've announced since 2022.
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u/Fox_of_Cintra 12h ago
Huh thank you
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u/eagc7 6h ago
Yeah one thing we tend to forget is that Loki aside, Marvel had no plans for any of their shows to be multi-season, it was all meant to be one offs. all of them
That plan changed with Daredevil Born Again, with VisionQuest being the last one of the One and Done era, as from now and on any show they do will be made with multiple seasons in mind (Of course...provided they do well)
2
u/PM_ME_YOUR_HOODIES 9h ago
I’m still bummed we may never see Midnight Suns. I’m hoping we could still get it with Ghost Rider confirmed to be happening… but I’ll also stay a little skeptical until they actually start filming after what happened with Blade.
1
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u/Krimreaper1 Iron man (Mark I) 10h ago
Moon Knight, She-Hulk, and Hawkeye should have had 2nd seasons
1
u/unfunnydick 7h ago
Daredevil killing Foggy in the opening bits pissed me off so much I just turned off the show and then cancelled Disney Plus, lol.
0
u/Pen_dragons_pizza 19h ago
I love daredevil but only got around to finishing the second series.
It’s arguably the best thing that marvel has put out in a very long time and a show that is very consistent with being good.
0
u/Brianshoe 17h ago
She-Hulk had that many viewings?!?! Nevermind, I know what people tuned it to watch!
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u/Thomas_JCG 18h ago
How tf Daredevil never made it? It was one of the most watched shows back on Netflix.
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u/KostisPat257 Daredevil 17h ago
The fact that it started out by killing one of the main characters of that show probably has something to do with it.
1
u/spyczech 17h ago
Or it didn't and your just projecting yoir fanboy rage over dead character
1
u/KostisPat257 Daredevil 16h ago
I personally have no problem with the story choice, just saying why many people might have given up on it.
1
u/Shiguhraki 16h ago
That has nothing to do with it. People didn’t want to watch 4-5 seadons of another show to catch up
1
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u/High_AspectRatio 15h ago
I only saw two seasons of Daredevil and had 0 inclination to watch the rest to watch reborn
1
u/BZenMojo Captain America (Cap 2) 7h ago
Then spent the next two seasons assassinating every single character that survived except Frank Castle.
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u/SaltyRefrigerator475 21h ago
NGL I didn't want born again because I've been boycotting Disney. I wish DareDevil had stayed with Netflix
2
u/Schoolhater18 20h ago
So have you been boycotting everything else that is Marvel? Skipped Spider-Man BND, you are going to skip Doomsday? If Daredevil was still on Netflix Disney would still benefit and make money off of it.
1
u/SaltyRefrigerator475 10h ago
I only started boycotting Disney after the Jimmy Kimmel stuff but honestly should've started sooner. I haven't watched any Disney stuff since and only keep up with the reviews and social media. The wishing DD staying on Netflix was more of a quality thing (we all know what almost happened to born again S1 before they fired all the writers and the Netflix writing team was a lot better).
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u/KostisPat257 Daredevil 21h ago
For anyone wondering why Wonder Man and Born Again were cancelled. Brad said we should start a #WatchDaredevil campaign before a #SaveDaredevil one and now I see what he means. It's sad, but it's the reality.
Born Again and Wonder Man are cheap to make, sure, but with these numbers, there was no way Disney would want to continue producing them.