r/melbourne • u/folkpunkboytoy • 1d ago
Politics Greens make $270M promise to create fast, frequent Melbourne bus grid
https://www.busnews.com.au/greens-make-270m-promise-to-create-fast-frequent-melbourne-bus-grid/81
u/Prime255 1d ago
You can't fix all the issues with scheduling, but you can connect bus services better to existing rail networks and use timed frequency where possible so passengers can move between services more easily
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u/newYearnew2025 1d ago
I'd like to be able to get a bus home from the train station after 9.30pm. I have to leave the city by 8.30pm to make sure that happens.
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u/universe93 8h ago
Same. It seems ridiculous to stop buses by 9.30pm in the suburbs when retail workers sometimes don’t finish work until 9pm at the earliest. I finish at 9 and can’t get the bus and a lot of my colleagues don’t even leave until 9.30.
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u/OkTemperature-8534 1d ago
Glad someone's trying to make it happen at least. Buses are the ugly ducklings of our public transport network exactly because they've been chronically underfunded for decades now.
The Department of Transport had already tabled the bus reform plan over three years ago, but you can't wear high vis and a hard hat to do photo-ops just for implementing a bus reform plan so the government rejected it in favour of spending further billions on the megaprojects instead...
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u/InfluentialFairy 1d ago
Busses crumble during any peak hour.. Schedules get thrown way out of whack..
I'd personally prefer more frequent trains, or even better suburban infrastructure for bicycles.
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u/jessta 1d ago
The west lacks good train coverage and doesn't have any trams so they are very reliant on buses as the main form of public transport. Buses are great if they're given bus lanes and traffic light priority.
Bicycle infrastructure is great and can be much faster than an infrequent bus over a short distance but it's not for everyone. Melbourne needs buses we can love like we love our trams.
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u/Chipchow 1d ago
I think you're right. Brisbane has a dedicated bus way direct to the city from the southern suburbs and its efficient and convenient for the outer suburbs. Something like this in the western suburbs would be great.
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u/danparkin10x 19h ago
It also costs a lot of money to build the basic infrastructure of the bus way. Once you've done that, you might as well just lay tracks and you have a train.
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u/Chipchow 19h ago
With the urban density isnt it more costly to do that? I thought that was the reason the buses were a more attractive option.
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u/Speedbird844 11h ago
That's the point - there isn't money for a train, but there may be enough for a busway. Once the busway is built it can be later converted to a train line. Also buses can peel off at will to feed the suburbs.
It's a bit like the 75 tram stopping at Vermont South. In that case Burwood Highway is built to accommodate the tram line going all the way to Knox, unfortunately there's just no money for it.
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u/Mushie_Peas 1d ago
My 12.5km cycle to work is 15 minutes faster than the bus by the time I walk to the bus stop.
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u/InfluentialFairy 1d ago
Cycling can be for everyone, people just need to be willing to do it. If you have decent infrastructure, separated from traffic, I'm certain people will use it. Also need better storage for bicycles at train stations.
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u/mr-snrub- 1d ago
Cycling is only for everyone when you forget the elderly and people with disabilities exist.
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u/jessta 16h ago
..and yet when we talk about driving we generally assume it's for everyone even though at least 30% of the population are completely unable to drive due to age or disability. This is even without addressing the financial impacts of age and disability that prevent people from being able to afford to access a car.
Being elderly doesn't prevent you from riding a bicycle. My uncle is 82 and still rides his bicycle. Certain kinds of disabilities can prevent people from riding but for many other disabilities bicycles are a great mobility aid (many people with disabilities that prevent them from walking use a bicycle to replace those walking trips)
A lot of people who's disability would exclude them from driving can still safely ride a bicycle; Slow reflexes, vision impairments, cognitive impairments etc.
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u/tidderresueman 1d ago
Cycling ends up 'for everyone' against their will, when idealistic wankers try to ignore the necessity, realities and hazards of traffic flow... They've finally fixed the turn off from Marine Parade to Glen Huntley Rd, back to what it was before fuck wits decided it would be enlightening to 'trial' heavy traffic giving way to, before crossing the path of, cyclists to turn right, therefore encouraging kamikaze cyclists to throw themselves infront of moving cars to assert right of way. Meanwhile there's a fucking bike path along the beach, meters away but fuck wits would rather don the lycra and gamble with their lives coz the environment! 🤦
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u/jessta 16h ago
I do love how everyone agrees that cars are insanely dangerous and motorist barely pay attention while driving them and barely know the rules. But it seems weird that the way a lot of people thing we should handle this is to make sure that everyone outside a car is very attentive, must know the rules completely and expect motorists to ignore the rules, and maybe just stay inside at home because streets are too dangerous for people to exist in.
If motorist can't figure out how to yield to traffic in a lane before merging across that lane then they are a serious danger to life and probably shouldn't be driving. The cyclists are not the ones creating the danger.
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u/tidderresueman 15h ago
If the cyclists in the particular place i mentioned used the fucking dedicated bike lane along the beautiful beach rather than attempting to wrestle with peak hour traffic there'd be alot less 'danger creation' going on... if you're riding your bike, you're not in a hurry so choose a safe and appropriate route dont be a fuckwit!
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u/blitznoodles 1d ago edited 1d ago
They crumble because of poor investment, Sydney's All day frequency bus network shows what is possible.
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u/kingboz 1d ago
Unfortunately I think we're too sprawled as a city to that cycling infrastructure just isn't going to be as popular as it is in smaller, dneser cities. Train coverage is very poor once you get to middle/outer suburbs, and building new lines wouldn't be too expensive for the service it would be adding.
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u/jessta 16h ago
The size of the city isn't important it's about how close to local services you are. 15mins on a bicycle will get you quite a long way (4-5km). Every child in greater Melbourne lives within cycling distance of their primary school. Most high school students live within cycling distance of their high school. Most of Melbourne is within cycling distance of a train station. Many people are cycling distance from their local supermarket.
60% of trips that people take in Greater Melbourne are less than a 15min bicycle ride.
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u/InfluentialFairy 1d ago
You're still generally within a few kilometres of a railway station, in most suburbs. That's a very serviceable area for a bicycle.
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u/jpettifer77 1d ago
But trains basically go to the city.
If you don’t want to go to the city, getting to a station can mean quite a long trip going in and coming back on a different line
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u/trueschoolalumni 22h ago
If only we could build an orbital train line, connecting the other train lines. It'd be mainly in the suburbs so we could call it the Suburban Orbital Loop.
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u/jpettifer77 15h ago
So instead of me going in to Richmond and back out on another line to go to work, I can go out to Clayton, catch the new train and then catch a train into work. I don’t think that will help me.
Or I can catch a bus which goes straight north.
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u/Haldered 20h ago
pity it costs 100x more than buses and will take several decades to build (if its ever completed).
If only there was an alternative that already exists
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u/yokobarron 1d ago
You’re living in fairy land. It took us how many years to build the metro tunnel? Frequent buses are the only reasonable fix to our public transport system.
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u/jammasterdoom 21h ago
I catch a bus to and from the train station. Since the metro tunnel opened, I’ve never had to wait more than 5 mins for a train. But there’s often no buses for 15, 20 mins.
We’ve all invested in this incredible show up and go rail service. It makes sense to integrate the buses into it.
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u/batteriesdrain 15h ago
Yeah i agree with ya. In my opinion Buses are actually a really great option as they link trains and trams and other buses and if it wasn't for the general traffic they'd be much quicker. And if they all PTV were quicker and and more frequent more people would probably opt in.
I feel if governments invested and we participated in all PTV services at a higher rate maybe driving could become obsolete for most people. Beside maybe courier and some trades people there could be like half the motor vehicles on roads. Freeing up space for buses.
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u/-_-Edit_Deleted-_- >Insert Text Here< 1d ago
Great idea in principle. But you can’t do it for 270m.
Making busses fast and frequent requires streets be designed as busses first, which I’m not necessarily opposed too. But it’s a lot more work than you can do for 270m. Traffic conditions need to change. Intersections rebuilt. Signage would need to be moved. And so much more.
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u/mr-snrub- 1d ago
Personally I think we should go the route of just having smaller buses like they do overseas. Other than school times suburban buses are mostly empty.
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u/Coz131 18h ago
The reason they are empty is because they are not frequent enough.
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u/Time-Weight7726 15h ago
The 402 has reasonably high patronage even outside of rush hour. It runs every 9 minutes or so during daylight hours.
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u/No-Bison-5397 11m ago
There’s something about that hopeless and helpless look you share with a fellow human in terrible weather waiting for a bus that comes once every 30 minutes and it’s 15 minutes late, it’s getting darker, you’re both maybe waiting with more young kids than can be moved by bike. Dinners going to be late. Everyone is going to be grumpy.
You know your bus is being held up by an infinite number of people trying to get home by car and you’re wondering why you’re not one of them.
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u/mr-snrub- 18h ago
I've taken buses with a 10-15-minute frequency, and "full" means everyone gets two seats each.
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u/fraqtl 19h ago
Maybe run more frequent smaller buses?
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u/GoGoGo12321 18h ago
Major cost of the bus system is paying the drivers. Doesn't make sense to run smaller, more frequent buses when it costs a whole lot more in terms of manpower. Regular sized buses with "good enough" frequency are probably cheaper to run, I'd imagine
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u/mr-snrub- 18h ago
Smaller buses could probably get away with paying the drivers less cause they wont have the same heavy vehicle requirements. They could just have a LR license instead.
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u/Ok-Foot6064 1d ago
This is just the old DTP bus reform program renamed. You can't do that for 270m period. Greens know they will never lead goverment so they never actually have to cost their policies properly
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u/dominatrixyummy 2h ago
I can’t really articulate why I feel this way, but busses are absolute dogshit. It’s not the frequency or reliability, I’d rather wait an hour for a train I know will take longer to get home than sit on a bus. Honestly I would rather walk in 40° heat than sit on a bus.
Maybe it was all the bullies on the school bus and derros at the bus stops
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u/Beast_of_Guanyin 1d ago edited 1d ago
The federal Greens used a russian propaganda term for Ukraine and have policy benefiting russia. Unless the state Greens renounce that there's no policy that'll make them anything but third last for me.
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u/andytheturtle 1d ago
Highly recommend this video: https://youtu.be/DQOjq0G3SBA?si=nvbimHcgH6-IvNp5
Beyond frequency, the routes require redesign. Seeing buses trapped at turns, on narrow suburban roads, or running over roundabouts shows they are ill-suited to small streets. Buses need not weave through every lane.