Paramore’s Hayley Williams unleashes profanity-filled response after DHS tells her to ‘thank’ ICE

[u/theindependentonline]

https://www.the-independent.com/arts-entertainment/music/news/hayley-williams-ice-dhs-paramore-response-b3062326.html

[u/Laiko_Kairen]

I know, I was there. I remember Obama being against my rights, and I remember him pivoting. I know they're unreliable allies. The issue I'm taking is when you paint "unreliable allies" as being the same as "hostile opposition."

That is manifestly false.

You're telling me to "look past" the fact that my rights have changed. I won't. I fought that fight for over a decade. I will not forget a decade of progress just because you have a myopic view.

How about you look past your ideological lens, stop dismissing my civil rights, and consider what point you're really trying to make. You've repeatedly said that my rights are a triviality to them. Stop ignoring that it's not a triviality to me. One party worked with me, one party worked against me, and those are facts.

[u/ihohjlknk → u/Laiko_Kairen]

What is frustrating about Democrats is they are unreliable, and that actually makes them more harmful than Republicans. Republicans are unabashed bigots and enemies of the people. That's no confusion here. I will always oppose Republicans because they only inflict harm.

Democrats being unreliable is how you break people's trust with them. Being let down over and over again by Democrats only alienates people from the party, or even moves them to the GOP (as we saw happen over the past decade).

This happens because Democrats favor political expediency over ideological principles. What does the Democratic party stand for? It cannot just be "We're the lesser evil". Harm mitigation is simply not enough. You cannot just offer Diet Coke when the GOP offers Coke.

[u/Fragrant-Education-3 → u/ihohjlknk]

And how is the strategy of turning ones nose up at the lesser evil going? Because there is now a risk that whatever turn in policy the Democrats do going forward will be undermined by the fact that people have elected to empower neo-nazis who are probably trying to work out how to never give up power again.

[u/ihohjlknk → u/Fragrant-Education-3]

So you're under the assumption that "Lesser Evil Voting" is a sound strategy? Because that's literally what I, and many americans, have been doing for years. And still the problems remain. The status quo sucks, and that discontent lead people to Trump because he promised things will change, even if it lead to catastrophe. The fact that people didn't care if the institutions got blown up by Trump is an indictment of the establishment.

And you refuse to acknowledge this reality and plug your ears instead, because you were comfortable with the status quo. The status quo worked for the wealthy and well-connected. It turns out, a lot of people didn't feel the same way.

And yeah, it sucks that we're living under the Trump Reich now. But you really don't believe that Kamala shares some of the blame for not offering an appealing platform that promised to shake up the status quo and not being Biden 2.0? Because that's what she did.

Just thinking about it really frustrates me, because there was a tiny window when Dems did the Biden switcheroo with Kamala, and she had a blank slate to redefine herself. Instead, the DNC consultants took over and offered more of the same neoliberal garbage. And doubly fuck Biden for depriving the Dems of an open primary by running for a second term when he was a walking vegetable.

[u/Fragrant-Education-3 → u/ihohjlknk]

I think it more than just sucks, the election saw an outcome that has fundamentally undermined global stability and has put the US on the cusp of being a oligarchical rouge state ala Putins Russia.

The Democrats and Harris were a paltry option, but I would put a fair amount of blame on voters who elected to gamble on Trump winning to make a point. You didn't have to like Harris or the Democrats to realise that they were always going to be easier to get concessions from. You were never going to change the status qou in a single election, it took MAGA decades to get to the point they are now. Even with the advantage of being backed by billions they still had to start with school boards and local councils.

Now it'll potentially be years to even get back to the Biden status quo. And it's questionable if it is actually possible at all considering that internationally the US is viewed at best as an inconsistent mess who are only ever four years away from electing an abject moron. At best the US has only gone further backwards, at worst someone like Biden might be seen as the best you will get for next few decades.

No one said people had to stop pushing or critiquing the government, in fact I imagine it would have been easier to do so under Harris because they aren't quite so willing to shoot protestors in street. If Trump isn't outsed in November what do you think will follow? Because MAGA won't debate, they'll more readily disappear you instead. They won't compromise, they'll just criminalise you.

Trump has changed the status quo, and its only benefited the wealthy. I ask again how is the not voting for the lesser evil as a strategy playing out so far? Because it doesn't look like its done anything but entrench a facist dictatorship, and those can take a lifetime or more to rectify once let out of the bottle.

[u/MadameFoxAdventures → u/Fragrant-Education-3]

I agree with almost everything EXCEPT that you think this election was the voters fault. The first Trump election, absolutely, the second I very much believe Elon and Trump when they basically confessed to rigging the election. There is no way electronic voting should have ever been allowed.