r/TopCharacterTropes • u/Ultrimus-Prime • 1d ago

miscellaneous Media Made to Prove the Haters Wrong

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Tunak Tunak Tun (Daler Mehndi) Critics claimed his music videos were only popular because they featured attractive women dancing. Mehndi responded by making a music video featuring nobody except multiple green-screen versions of himself. It became a massive hit and his most famous song.

Five Nights at Freddy’s - Scott Cawthon previously made a family-friendly game called Chipper & Sons Lumber Co. Critics complained that the characters looked like creepy animatronics. Rather than abandon that visual style, Cawthon decided to turn them into an actual horror game using scary animatronics.

Superman Kingdom Come - Mark Waid and Alex Ross were reacting to the 1990s trend of increasingly violent, cynical superheroes.

Their story deliberately challenged the belief that traditional superheroes like Superman were outdated. It portrayed the consequences of abandoning heroic ideals and argued that compassion, restraint, and morality were still essential to superheroes.

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u/SatoruGojo232 1d ago edited 1d ago

Spider-Man being created by Stan Lee and Steve Ditko despite Stan's publisher telling him that people hate spiders and nobody would care about a mainline teenager superhero with personal problems (since at that time most teens in superhero comics were sidekicks, and superheroes were mostly role models without flaws)

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u/Careful_Welcome7999 1d ago

Its kinda funny that they thought people wouldn't like to read about a teenager going through the struggles of life like losing a parental figure and having to find a job to help his family when people LOVE these kinds of stories

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u/WJMazepas 1d ago

But there werent many teenager stories like this back then

And especially not stories like superheros aimed at children and teenagers

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u/phdemented 1d ago

Teen comics back then were stuff like Archie and other comedy/romance stuff

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u/South_Dakota_Boy 1d ago

This is part of why “The Catcher in the Rye” (1951) is so beloved as well.

It’s basically the angsty teen archetype.

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u/jerpyderpy 1d ago

I'm reading it right now and i would have loved it as an angsty teen. but now im 40 and it's kinda lame 😂

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u/the_ghost_of_bob_ros 1d ago

Kinda the opposite of you, I think I would have hated the book if I read it when I was younger, but now as an older adult I can read it and understand just how sad Holden is, like kid had a rough go of it and parts of the story just make you wanna give him a hug and tell him its going to get better.

most younger people tend to gloss over him having very clear trauma from his brothers death and his own ptsd from sexual assault.

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u/dearth_of_passion 1d ago

I dunno. I was in high school in the mid 2000s and it was assigned reading. Nobody liked Holden, nobody's related to him.

His version of angsty teen was probably relevant and relatable when it was written, but by 2005 it was decidedly embarrassing. Instead of feeling like "this character is saying everything I wish I could say, and feeling things I feel", it was much more of "I'm 15 and even I think this kid is a dick".

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u/ShatnersChestHair 1d ago

I read it in my early twenties and it resonated much more because I could tell that yes, Holden is a dick, but mostly because he's trying to hide hurt and confusion behind a flimsy web of fancy words and fake philosophy. Which is exactly what I, and many others, did as a teenager. I would have hated being confronted with that kind of mirror when I was 15 but as a 20-something it was much easier to stomach.

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u/kitsunewarlock 1d ago

"Teenager" (as we know it) were a relatively new concept. The word itself was coined in 1910 and only became widely known as a marketing term after WW2. Before then people of "teen age" were just considered children or adults, depending on the context.

And by "depending on the context" I mean the same 14 year old would be called "just a child" if he was killed during wartime, but one of likely several "men" if he died in a coal mine collapse.

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u/o4zloiroman 1d ago

I honestly never thought of it. TIL.

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u/DeconstructedKaiju 7h ago

Children being allowed to have a 'childhood' (freedom, education, toys, being protected, not having to work) is also fairly modern. Back in the day the second you could hold something, you were working, and you were working as long and as hard as the rest of the family, depending on what you could do.

'Childhood' was also something only the rich could enjoy for a while until laws against child labor were passed.

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u/VT_Squire 1d ago

Huh. That explains some things. 

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u/botte-la-botte 1d ago

Yeah, but you have to see it in full context. Those people might have said this to Stan, but they still published Amazing Fantasy #15 with a tease for a future Spider-Man comic.

Marvel back then had an extremely limited distribution system. There was a strict limit to the number of comics they were able to publish each month. So taking a chance on an unproven concept was very risky, and yet those same people who were unconvinced still did it.

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u/AlmendraJota 1d ago

Hindsight is always 20/20

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u/RedGuyNoPants 1d ago

The 60s was the first time a significant number of “teens” had disposable money and could be catered to. People hadn’t spent much time beforehand thinking of what type of things teens wanted

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u/celticdude234 1d ago

Because that didn't happen in the 60s. Nope. Never. /s

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u/badcrass 1d ago

That's what Archie is for...

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u/STylerMLmusic 1d ago

Executives have never been right about anything.

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u/FiaGiolla 1d ago

Iron Man is another case of this, Lee set out to take the most unlikable kind of person and make him likable

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u/wvj 1d ago

Just about all the boom of comics that brought them to their modern popularity was based on these humanizing stories over the more grandiose stuff.

Somewhat ironically, Stan kind of missed the mark when he got to the X-Men, and it wasn't until they got rebooted under Claremont that they got this kind of treatment. And it was (yet again) so wildly popular it basically spawned the Bronze Age & drove the next 20 years of comics, with everyone copying the X-Men as a model (notably, DC's Teen Titans reboot was explicitly for this purpose).

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u/rynshar 1d ago

And "Sergeant Fury and His Howling Commandos" was a bet to see if they could sell a comic with the worst name ever.

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u/MCdemonkid1230 1d ago

And now look at Spider-Man Brand New Day making $2.5 billion at the box office, a worldwide hit, second to Endgame.

Wonder what the publisher would be saying now.

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u/Warm-Requirement-769 1d ago

Something like this

https://giphy.com/gifs/1GT5PZLjMwYBW

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u/Feedback-Mental 1d ago

"Boy I'm so glad to have been proven wrong" is the most sane answer, I think.

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u/Party_Advantage_3733 1d ago

Or maybe "Good job I trusted my staff and let them do that thing despite my personal doubts about it"

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u/Feedback-Mental 1d ago

That works, too.

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u/Autistic_Doggi 1d ago

they would rather fucking die than say that shit man are you drunk😭

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u/Party_Advantage_3733 1d ago

Probably "Thanks for all the money Stan"

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u/Dropbeatdad 1d ago

"I'm in charge here, they pay me a shit-ton of money to give my put of touch opinions on things and then face zero consequences when I'm completely wrong."

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u/cantadmittoposting 1d ago

I mean... they DID publish it, so i'm not sure that's quite correct here, there wasn't so much ego that it never happened, which is a good thing.

"I'm happy to be proven wrong" is a legitimately great position to take.

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u/Soulful-Sorrow 1d ago

The publisher who told them that Spider-Man was a bad idea saw Amazing Fantasy #15 fly off the shelves then said that Spider-Man was a great idea.

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u/Cupcakes_n_Hacksaws 1d ago

I got kinda burnt out on MCU movies after the finale of End Game personally; I haven't seen it yet, but why is it so successful?

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u/HUGE_FUCKING_ROBOT 1d ago

im also burned out on MCU, but spiderman has always been about grounded street level threats and peter's day to day issues are very relatable. and the story is well contained and stays in its lane. furthermore spidermans quips and banter come off way more naturally than the constant jokes being hammered into other MCU IP.

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u/Cupcakes_n_Hacksaws 1d ago

I already got spoiled with the major story beats but I'll definitely check it out then if I can catch it somewhere for cheap. Actually looking forward to Dr. Doom though, one of my favorite villains

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u/R_V_Z 1d ago

What most people from back then would say if they were transported to modern times:

"Have you seen this internet thing? There's naked people on it!"

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u/Nazarii_Breton 1d ago

Steve Ditko and Stan Lee

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u/Time_Traveling_Idiot 1d ago

I actually think they're slipping from the plot AGAIN.

Yes Peter Parker (the Tom Holland version) is a teenager (not anymore but shush) with personal problems, but it doesn't feel real any more. Like a fever dream, or just a "superhero misery" type suffering, not something tangible like we saw with Tobey Maguire's spiderman.

Tobey Maguire's spiderman was an actual nerd, a normal person with actual problems and a distinct lack of charisma. HE FELT REAL.

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u/DoubleStrength 1d ago

Tobey Maguire's spiderman was an actual nerd

Counterpoint: was Tobey Peter ever portrayed building Star Wars Lego with his nerdy best friend while quoting Lord Of The Rings to each other, shortly after inventing and creating a universal power inhibitor just from dumpster diving?

I don't think so.

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u/DarkWaWeeGee 1d ago

Fair point, looking back on it, Tobey was only really shown as a nerd by being good in school and wimpy. That's kinda it. No inventions, nothing to really SHOW that yeah, Peter's a nerd.

Tom shows the nerd stuff. Yeah, he's smart, he says smart things, but he also BUILDS things. He has a setup in BND to monitor the city, he works on his own regulator after seeing the surface of Banner's own work, the other Avengers are ANNOYED with how smart he is. Not even flaunting it, he's just a more likeable "Um ackshually ☝️🤓" person. Plus ofc he's sad, it's a Peter movie. There's literally memes that say Peter Parker thinks himself the "virgin" when other heroes visualize him as a "chad". That's his character. That's HIM

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u/Time_Traveling_Idiot 1d ago

?? wdym he doesn't build anything? He designs and stitches his suit from scratch, based on research on what materials would work best, and it looks amazing.

Tom Holland spiderman is literally "he's such a genius he can literally make world-changing technology, that nobody else could make, using scraps, in just 1 day!". It's not relatable. He's basically a magician.

If you ask me, being good at science and knowing enough to sew a high-quality costume is MUCH closer to "real life nerd" than being able to singlehandedly whip up technology that literal corporations couldn't make.

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u/DarkWaWeeGee 23h ago

On your point, designing/stitching a suit from scratch based on research (keep in mind he's a STEM nerd) is borderline magic. A poor kid being good at sewing is believable (Tobey and Tom's first suits), but becoming good at them is different.

Tom inherits a lot of Stark Tech/Teachings, not really handcrafted. You're telling me Tobey can create full on suits and instead of selling them for bank decides to be poor and sell pizza? Yeah, ok.

Love Tobey, but you can't call Tom out without calling out Tobey. Tom sticks with the comic accuracy of having 400+ IQ. Not really sure how he knows some things, but it also makes sense in context for him TO know. Tobey, again, is really just book smart (and ig also a genius fashion designer).

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u/Wild-Atmosphere2134 1d ago

tobey's peter nerdness is genuinely shallower than peter in homecoming idk what you're on

but with the misery, while it's true that tobey's suffering is more grounded, peter's suffering in BND (because spider-man's suffering is pretty different) feels grounded in a similar way by him trying to navigate a world without his lover (relatable despite all the memory loss stuff). it's likely just a sign of the times changing

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u/violapalle 1d ago

Imagine if he had more spider-like attributes though, I don’t think most people would vibe as much with a superhero with 8 spindly limbs and eyes

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u/TBTabby 1d ago

They also thought people wouldn't like a spider-themed superhero, because people hate spiders. But they didn't like bats much either.

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u/Muracapy 1d ago

My headcannon is that Peter Parker suffers so much in his stories because the publishers are still salty he proved them wrong.

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u/EmperorPickle 1d ago

Wasn’t Miles written to spite the losers that said Spidey can’t be black?

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u/Ultrace-7 1d ago

This was literally one of the reasons that Marvel surpassed DC as the premier comic book publisher for decades. Spider-Man, X-Men, and even the Fantastic Four featured teenage superheroes who were going through the concepts of coming of age alongside coming into their powers. DC's old guard were...old by comparison, and it felt that way.

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u/NsaLeader 1d ago

It's funny to think that in one point in time (in the early 00's, might still be true), Spider-Man was more recognizable than Jesus internationally (alongside Bat-Man and Coca-cola I think).

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u/21Shells 1d ago

I don't think spiders are that bad. I mean, its better than Fly-man right? No one would feel right watching Peter puke on his hands, slap the green goblin round his face (giving him super-shigella, causing him to shit out half his body weight in bloody diarrhoea) before laying eggs in his stomach. Just saying, there were worse choices.

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u/PossibilityLivid8873 1d ago

This mf made me like spiders

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u/MyvaJynaherz 1d ago

Spiderman has remained revelant because...

he's still relevant.

Not the struggles, those are important because they always feel like struggles.

But because his character has remained as something with a piece of the person that average people resonate with.

Billionaire tech-guy or Ethnically-superior foreign demi-gods aren't relatable for anyone but a handfull of people that don't need fantasy to make their dreams into reality.

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u/AnyIllustrator3253 21h ago

Imagine almost missing out on Spider-Man because someone thought teenagers with real problems wouldn’t sell, when that’s exactly what made generations of us feel seen.