r/snowboarding • u/Busy-Worth-416 Iowa • 1d ago
Gear question Instructor Board
Hello! I've never made a post here, but I have some questions and thought I'd give it a shot. I am looking to become a snowboard instructor this year in the midwest (yay!) and wondering about some board recs and advice for the year.
Mainly, I'm wondering how beat up I can expect my board to get.
I have a Nidecker Venus 2023 148/146 cm currently, which I LOVE. But, it's directional, weighted in the back, and it has a fatal flaw for the midwest: it really struggles on sheets of ice.
I'm looking for another board and new bindings this year (unfortunately, have been very disappointed with my Burton Scribes). I'm very drawn to the Burton Yeasayer 144 cm, but I don't want a top-of-the-line board to get totally ruined in lesson teaching. I'm sizing down a bit because the 148 is a bit long for my size. I would pair the Yeasayer with Union Trilogy bindings, I think.
Should I just buy a beater board secondhand and expect it to get ruined, or is it safe to invest in the board I want? Also, any advice for a new instructor would be great! Can't wait for the season start!
Thanks!
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u/AcingSpades 1d ago
Yes Basic. True twin, mid soft, excellent ice hold. Damn near perfect teaching board for the Midwest and it's still a hoot for post work hot laps.
In my experience my boards don't really get really any more dinged up than usual riding during teaching unless it's an adaptive or a tot lesson. Those are a little more prone to your gear being run over.
If you can find one used I'd go for it but if you're already hired on you might be able to qualify for a pro deal now (or soon after starting) to help with cost of new.
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u/Busy-Worth-416 Iowa 1d ago
The Yeasayer?
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u/AcingSpades 1d ago
The Yeasayer Camber would be okay but the Flying V is a hard no. Even the older Yeasayer Flat Top could be fine, especially your first year since you'll mostly have kids lessons, but camber between the bindings is much, much better for ice especially as you progress into teaching carved turns.
I'd still take the Yes Basic over any iteration of the Yeasayer. Incredible ice performance with the underbite edges for something still relatively catch free. Very versatile board that lends itself well to "I don't know what kind of lesson I'll be given today".
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u/Busy-Worth-416 Iowa 1d ago
Oh, I hadn't even realized there were different Yeasayers, I will look at that. Thanks!
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u/corkbeverly 1d ago
they were suggesting the Yes Basic which is not a burton board, but a board by Yes Snowboards.
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u/Busy-Worth-416 Iowa 1d ago
Ah, I see! I am not familiar with that brand. I tend to stick to brands that I know their origin and goals (Jones, Roxy, Burton, Sims, etc)
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u/AcingSpades 1d ago
I mean... Google stuff you don't know. Comes right up. Also wild that you've never seen such a major brand in recommendations or shops. Kinda silly to insinuate that your lack of familiarity with them is their fault when you're the only one who can educate yourself.
Yes was founded in 2008 by pro riders in collaboration with the Nidecker Group (which also owns Nidecker, Rome, Jones, Bataleon, and Thirtytwo) and is actually transitioning out of Nidecker Group back to independent ownership starting this season. It's actually super exciting to support Yes right now since these consolidation groups are becoming more common and brands are largely less rider focused than ever.
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u/Busy-Worth-416 Iowa 1d ago
Can I ask - what is the difference between the flying V and the basic Yeasayer? Looking at the specs, I don't see too much
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u/AcingSpades 1d ago edited 1d ago
There is no "basic Yeasayer". Burton makes multiple boards that have the same name but multiple profiles. The construction of the board is the same (base material, biax vs triax, sidewalls, etc) so the spec sheet and things like flex and shape are the same but the Yeasayer Camber and the Yeasayer Flying V will ride fairly differently because of the profile. Honestly I wish they just had different names because they're functionally different boards.
Flying V is always going to be looser, surfer, and have less edge hold. There is rocker between the inserts so the middle of the board doesn't have any "bite". Then there's small sections of camber under the feet and rocker to tip and tail. It'll be much easier to spin, more maneuverable, more forgiving, and have better float in powder. It'll also be less catchy. But it has a significant detriment in ice. Like awful. It's not great for stability at speed or deep carves.
The Yeasayer Camber is Burton's PurePop Camber profile which is really more of a camrock profile. Camber in the center of the board to just about the inserts then a zone of flat to the tip and tail. Better edge hold, greater stability, greater carving ability, and more pop. The flat zones keep it from feeling super catchy like a full camber and help in powder.
I'd read up on snowboard construction. Adult beginners love to ask for gear recommendations lol so it's nice to know what you're talking about.
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u/Busy-Worth-416 Iowa 1d ago
That's good to know! I read quite a few blogs and reviews on snowboards, but I definitely missed there being two different Yeasayers. Sounds like the flying V is not going to do well on midwest ski hill snow at all. If it's a camrock, it'll probably behave a bit like my Nidecker. Good to know. Thank you!!
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u/AcingSpades 1d ago
Yes, the Yeasayer Camber would be fairly similar to your Venus. It doesn't have true rocker to the tips so less powder friendly (also obviously twin vs directional) and a little less forgiving of skidded turns but those flat sections do mellow things out. I don't teach on my full camber board for a reason lol.
Plenty of camrock options on the market (like the Yes Basic 😉). Double and triple check that they're camber between the feet. Lots of Lib Tech (and sub brands Gnu / Roxy before Mervin killed em) profiles are very similar to Flying V if not worse, especially in the women's lines. A touch less atrocious in the ice due to their edge tech (which is why you'll see them recommended so much for Midwest and East Coast) but still not what I would recommend for you.
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u/GreyGhost878 1d ago
I agree about the Basic. Even the camber Yeasayer is a downgrade in edge grip from her Venus, which is also a camber board and a bit stiffer than the Yeasayer. As another midwestern rider, edge tech is a real asset.
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u/TimeTomorrow Vail Inc. Sucks 1d ago
it has better than average ice hold. not quite lib/gnu/arbor/jones/never summers best.
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u/AcingSpades 1d ago
I mean I agree that all of those brands are generally above average in ice hold but it's absolutely nuts to say that the Basic is not as good as entire brands regardless of individual board specs. A Lib Tech Skate Banana absolutely does not have better ice hold even with magnetraction. And Lib/Gnus lines are chock full of rocker profiles.
I own an Arbor Cadence Camber and a Jones Flagship. My Yes Basic has better ice hold than either. I have two friends with Never Summer Lady FRs which have better ice hold than other friends' Jones Dream Weaver, Jones Mountain Twin, Arbor Element, and Arbor Coda but still slip noticably more often than the Basic. The only board out of the probably two dozen in our friend group that generally outperforms the Basic in ice grip is a Yes Typo.
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u/SwedishSanta Instructor in Japan 1d ago
For beginner lessons I use a well worn, soft park board that doesn't care that people ride on it. Since you are just becoming an instructor, you will only teach beginners
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u/Busy-Worth-416 Iowa 1d ago
That's what I expect. I'm in Central Iowa at a whopping 300ft elevation ski hill, and the instructors vary significantly in abilities, so I'm not sure what to expect until I try I guess
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u/Superb-Potential8426 1d ago
Get something that is easy, A mid flex cambered twin with wavy edges (for ice) that can get trashed. And more importantly bindings that are super easy to get in and out of... such as the case for step-in bindings.
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u/Busy-Worth-416 Iowa 1d ago
I thought a lot about getting step ins, but I decided that I did not want them because I would have to get new boots, and I just got my current pair broken in finally
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u/-G_Man- 1d ago
Something with traction tech like the Jones Twin Sister. There’s Lib Tech as well I just don’t know their models.
If you’re an instructor you can probably get a pro deal with most brands.
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u/Busy-Worth-416 Iowa 1d ago
I honestly think the Nidecker's issue with the ice is that it's such a stiff board that it's very hard to flex it enough to get the edge dug into the ice coat. I'm sure it doesn't help that the board is a bit big on me too lol
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u/TimeTomorrow Vail Inc. Sucks 1d ago
ice bumps do help with ice on the east coast.
Lib/gnu/arbor/jones/capita's with deathgrip/etc will outperform the boards without ice tech or with less aggressive ice tech (yes, burton, etc).
If it's not a rail board I see no reason to own a board without aggressive ice tech in the midwest.
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u/chatrugby 1d ago
Your boards will become very beat up. Use what ever board you like, I favored twin tip boards so I could demo forward and switch, but I’ve shown up on the bunny slope with a pow board, have used a rock board that had edges ripping out of it, I’ve even taught snowboard lessons while on 1 ski.
As for damage, newbs on lifts love to kick their boards around and don’t know that slamming edges into other edges chips boards and causes damage.
A new board will get dinged up really quickly, that said, they are tools at that point. If you work this gig long term, you’ll want fresh boots and board every season.
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u/Busy-Worth-416 Iowa 1d ago
I’m probably moving to Utah next year for college and paramedic school, so whether I end up on the teaching or the ski patrol side long term is up in the air but it’ll prolly be one of those
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u/Right-Individual-409 1d ago edited 1d ago
Been an instructor for 20 seasons now. If you don’t mind dedicating a current board just for working, second hand works great too. It’s ski swap sale season so there’s a lot out there . Definitely get a true twin because you will be doing demos switch. Also lots of switch riding so you can keep your student in sight. I prefer a hybrid leaning more towards rocker, a lot more catch-free. I also size down a bit. Usually ride a 165. I use something around. 160 for instructing. Hope this helps and enjoy.
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u/Busy-Worth-416 Iowa 1d ago
Thank you so much! I actually found a ski swap sale on Sunday in my local area, which I will definitely check out!
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u/GopheRph 1d ago
I’d expect the bulk of your riding as an instructor to be demonstrations of the basic drills leading up to making turns, and then low speed skidded turns after that. If the conditions are bad enough that you’re struggling with ice, your students on rental gear are not going to be keeping up with you. You will take more damage to your board with your own students and other new skiers and boarders around you. I’d suggest a used soft to mid flex twin, personally. Some flex is nice so you can demo body movements and your students can see your board flexing as intended.
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u/Busy-Worth-416 Iowa 1d ago
Yeah, I am smack dab in the middle of the good ol' central Iowa, currently. I have a whopping 300 ft (ish) of elevation at my local ski hill where I'm hopefully going to work, so they make most of their snow, and it's very crusty stuff. I think the Yeasayer is like a medium flex, which will hopefully be better at ice than the hard flex nidecker.
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u/doubleflusher 1d ago
Agreed with others here. Get a twin, soft, basically a jib board. Plus, I always opted for step ins, cuz you'll be constantly getting out and going back up the bunny to help kids and new riders.
Yes, you'll get a ton of little dings and scratches, but usually nothing major
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u/MathematicianMany642 1d ago
I was an instructor at a small ski hill too. I always used my old beat up twin park/rail board. I think having a twin is nice because I always liked to demonstrate drills switch if I had goofy riders. My board definitely got very beat up too
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u/TheMisled 23h ago edited 12h ago
For bindings, I'd imagine you'll be getting on and off a lot. Maybe look at going for a step in binding for quicker and easy entry/exit. Between step-ons, supermatics, FASE, and flow/rear entry, my pick would be FASE. Compatible with all boots, and not as heavy as supermatics, same two strap feels and a good selections of bindings to choose from. Supermatics are a close second as well.
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u/NCGeronimo 161 Nokhu/158 Wagyu 13h ago
Agree with the case binding rec. Especially for demoing getting strapped in and out for newbies, can't do that with the step ins.
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u/swishy_slidey Ride sleep ride repeat 1d ago
Best things for ice are camber and learning how to tune your edges! You can get a lot of performance out of a tuned board. Some tactics that you should learn as an instructor should help as well
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u/Busy-Worth-416 Iowa 1d ago
I definitely want to learn about tuning and waxing my own board! My hope this year as an instructor is that teaching will greatly improve my own personal riding. Also, free ski pass
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u/swishy_slidey Ride sleep ride repeat 1d ago
It will improve your riding! Take advantage of any training opportunities you can get and approach snowboarding as constant progression and you’ll have a blast!
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u/Busy-Worth-416 Iowa 1d ago
Yes! I am very excited! Next year I will hopefully move out West for college (but also mostly for snowboarding lol) in Utah, and I really want to be able to start doing some tricks and keeping up with my big brother, so crossing my fingers that this gig works out and teaching helps me learn!
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u/Infinite_Forever7989 1d ago
Get a twin tip board that's best up. Kids will run you over or you'll use your board/body to block them from doing dumb shit.
Everytime I explain to a kid how to get in the lift their brain stops working the moment it's time. They will clack the shit out of your board. You can't fault them it's their first time.
But yeah get a beat up board or a used park board. I had a yes standard that was shredded I used. Then I started used a yes the greats that I shredded myself. Asym boards make fun rides for newbies on the lift because every single one will ask you why it's shaped like that lol.
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u/GreyGhost878 1d ago
Your board isn't going to get wrecked on the bunny hill. They're built incredibly tough and it normally takes a higher speed impact (and/or a much heavier rider) to do damage. The worst you're going to get are scratches and dings on your top sheet. (Of course there are no guarantees but generally speaking.)
For instructing (which I did part-time back in the day) I would want a board on the smaller and more flexible side. The Yeasayer would be a good one EXCEPT you're looking for better edge grip and the Yeasayer is actually worse, even the camber version. Consider a board with some edge tech. I have a Rossignol Airis and it's a great all-mountain freestyle board with edge tech, and would be excellent for instructing. Comes in 143 and 146. (I have the 143 and wish I had gone with the 146 for a bit more stability when carving. I'm 115 lbs.) Jones Twin Sister is a great option for your own riding. It would be very similar to the Venus but a bit of an upgrade and with better edge grip, and still fine for instructing due to its twin shape and easy turning profile. Also has good sizing options. (And Jones is a good company, since that's important to you.) And the Yes Frenzy. Another great board that has everything you need. Or the Jones Tweaker (if you want something softer/more playful than the Twin Sister.)
When I instructed I had a Burton Feelgood, so a plank of a camber board. It was never a problem. My strong recommendation is to get a camber or hybrid camber board, not a rocker profile (for example Flying V.) This is for your own benefit and progression. As you twist and turn your own board all those hours and days and weeks on the bunny hill, you will build muscle memory and skill like never before. The most I ever progressed in a season was the one I taught beginners, and I had been bombing big mountains for years before then. A camber dominant profile will make you a better rider as you teach others, without even realizing it.
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u/Fluid_Stick69 1d ago
I never found it worthwhile to buy a beater board specifically to teach on. You never know what skill level you’ll end up with. Even in first timer lessons you never know how much they’ll progress. And in those higher level lessons I want to have my go to with me. Some people bring out their pow boards when teaching in fresh snow, and while I have done that. Your students will probably be on a twin so I’d rather ride a twin as well. So it makes more sense to me to have 1 board that I trust to do well in just about any conditions. That being said my boards do get pretty beat up. It takes me about a season and a half to kill a snowboard. But I also go for sketchy stuff even when I know better since I kill snowboards so fast. For me that’s a pro but for most that’s a con. After a seasonor two you’ll get really good at finding deals so you aren’t worried about losing money on a board
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u/alumpoflard 18h ago
You would want a twin tipped board with a conventional camber profile. The board is meant to behave similarly to a learners board (but doesn't need to be as soft) so that when you demonstrate a technique, the board behaves a certain way. When the student copies your technique, the board behaves similarly.
You get a bit more normal wear and tear, but mostly because you're just riding more. Proper teaching is done in a way that your student never has much risk of their board knocking into yours (except maybe at chairlift)
Most ski schools would require an instructor certificate in order to work with you, be it AASI or CASI, BASI, SBINZ. When you get your cert and be a paying member, you have access to a whole range of pro deals including clothing
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u/Ok-Watercress-7914 1d ago
A snowboard instructor going to Reddit for advice? Ok.
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u/shes_breakin_up_capt 1d ago
Then again, look above, loads of instructors here.
I like that about this place, always someone who knows more.
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u/Busy-Worth-416 Iowa 1d ago
Yep! Unfortunately, I do not live in a snowboarding community or know anyone personally who has instructor experience.
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u/SendyMcSendFace Tahoe 1d ago
Topsheet dings galore, but I wouldn’t expect any major damage. Normal wear and tear will happen a bit faster just due to being on the board more.
Recommend getting a board you’re gonna be stoked to ride. I would wait until you’re hired though so you can buy on prodeal if you’re thinking new.
Also, twin tip is a must for teaching.