- You get a license, you don't buy the game (of course)
- You aren't allowed to publish recordings, screenshots etc. or stream the game without a disclaimer that it's not supported by Krafton Inc. (and that the footage is subject to the EULA... however that is meant to work.)
- Cannot upload such content to a paid platform (presumably such as Patreon or a Youtube members-only video)
- Krafton can of course take away your access to the game at any point for any reason without prior notice (something they continuously bring up in the EULA lol)
- The terms of the agreement can change at any point for any reason without any notice by Krafton and you of course must regularly check the terms to make sure 😃
- They reserve the right to remote access the game, whatever they mean by this
- It is not allowed to use the game for commercial gain (presumably such as streaming etc.) without Kraftons permission
- You cannot play the game on more than one device without purchasing additional licenses
- You cannot modify the game illegally and if you do Krafton owns that modification
- A bunch of weird clauses that just prohibit behaviour outside of the game, including tarnishing Kraftons reputation
- You are not allowed to deceive or exploit Krafton, the definition of which is determined by, you guessed it, Krafton 😃
- You are not allowed to exploit bugs
- You are not allowed to use external programs such as macros or cheat engine
- You are not allowed to have indecent nicknames or nicknames that cause negative associations (good luck if you have "death" or "killer" or something in your nickname lmao)
- You are not allowed to use someone else's account to access the game
- You are not allowed to USE A VPN or any technology that masks your location (hmmmm i wonder why they have this clause)
- You are not allowed to spam content from the game? Like this is actually what it says. You cannot publish content from the game in a manner that counts as spamming. Wtf
- YOU ARE NOT ALLOWED TO TAKE ACTIONS THAT GO AGAINST "SOCIAL NORMS". I'M NOT KIDDING, THIS IS ACTUALLY IN THERE.
- You are not allowed to create any content that is based on the IP (presumably such as fan art etc.), and if you do, they own it
- Any player created from the game content belongs to them as well.
- They do not guarantee a smooth gameplay experience (this was just funny)
- A bunch of clauses that they cannot be held accountable if you suffer any damages, but even if they could, they would pay a MAXIMUM of 50 US-Dollars. lmao
- Not sure if the EULA counts as documentation for the game, but if so, then "using" the documentation of the game means you give up the right to sue Krafton or their employees for anything.
So, presumably, by reading the EULA (using the documentation) you already give up the right to sue them. Crazy work
- You have no right to a refund under any circumstances unless forced to by law or enforced by the platform the game was sold on.
- If you break the TOS outlined in this EULA, you give up the right to a refund
- They can delete your account if your information is not accurate
- Most of these terms continue to apply AFTER termination of the contract (such as when uninstalling or refunding the game or when they take away your access to it)
- If you have any issues with the EULA you have to inform them in writing first
- If that doesnt work, you have to fight them on terms set by them in San Ramon, California under US Law (in english)
- You give up the right to have a judge or jury preside over the case. I don't even know how that would work but you give up that right (including class actions of course)
- They can make demands of you without having to show any damages they have suffered
- If you think they stole art or other copyrighted material from you then in order to get it removed you must give them a bunch of personal information including your real identity and signature
- Despite having a lower age rating in most places, you still have to be 18 to play the game
- They can harvest your personal data (email, phone number, IP, birth date, gender, country etc.) as well as device information (including the unique ID of your device)
- They pass this data on to third party providers such as cloud services or marketing agencies
- They do not guarantee that your data is kept safe with them lmao

I say the majority because I think that’s the biggest gaming community on Reddit and reading the comments I just see that the general perception of the movement has changed… enough to the point where I don’t think it has enough thrust anymore if gamers in general, the most affected person of this relationship, are not willing to fight back.

I was curious about you guys thoughts on this topic.

Edit: also I really meant THRUST and not trust. For me at least, the biggest thruster on a social cause was the people that cared and were affected by it, and people are surprisingly saying that’s not that big of a problem losing access to games

Edit 2: I badly expressed myself on the title and now I can’t edit. But in resume, I meant the majority of people engaged on the post I’m referencing and the subreddit I’m referencing.

Anyone participating in that PlayStation blackout this week? (honestly I feel like it should be a month or better yet the remainder of the year because when it comes to this kinds of boycotts, they don’t usually work unless enough noise is made, not just from the enthusiasts, but from the average joes as well)

Several media outlets in various countries have reported that SKG has joined the lawsuit against Sony in the Netherlands for monopolistic practices. Here are two examples, but there are many more:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/gaming/playstation/stop-killing-games-joins-dutch-consumer-group-s-457m-lawsuit-against-sony-over-digital-store-monopoly/ar-AA29V9Io

https://www.yahoo.com/news/politics/articles/stop-killing-games-backs-dutch-154929003.html

However, when searching for more information on this, I haven't been able to find anything "official" from SKG. Have I searched incorrectly, or is this clickbait? Since I don't have an X or anything similar, I don't know if there has been any official statement.

If this is true, although it is a legitimate fight, I am concerned that SKG will get sidetracked or diluted in its fight against digital consumer rights, since many of us see that even if discs make a comeback, there is still an elephant in the room problem.

Edit: As I mentioned to a user, on the one hand, your capacity isn't infinite and is limited to a specific timeframe and scope of action. Dividing that capacity into two tasks does have an impact. I don't think SKG has a large capacity or a top-tier law firm, unfortunately. I suppose it's a move with just enough financial backing. I'm just guessing, but that's my hunch.

On the other hand, I think Sony's decision puts you in a privileged position if you're pushing to guarantee digital rights with European regulators, who have no idea about the poor state of current physical formats. A sudden change of course by Sony could lessen that sense of urgency among legislators regarding a digital rights law.

So if the physical edition is basically just a case with a download code instead of an actual disc, does that mean the second-hand market is pretty much gone? Once the code is redeemed, I assume you can’t resell the game like a normal physical copy anymore. Am I understanding this correctly?

Just a bit of a quick question how do you all feel about the news of Pokemon Bank? Upset? Sad? Both? Do you think that Nintendo and Gamefreak could have come up with something else other than just closing Bank making it impossible to complete pokedexes for older games or etc?

Edit: IMO I don't think Bank should close as it discourages you to play older games also the fact that they also didn't announce an alternative method to bridge connections to old games is surprising to me as Pokemon has always been about connectivity and closing Bank just ruins that.

GOG is a digital distribution platform with a mission statement of "We make games last forever". From my knowledge, they supported SKG at first, but withdrew their support later on. Now, CD PROJEKT, which is in the group of VIDEOGAMES EUROPE through NATIONAL TRADE ASSOCIATIONS, sold GOG. What is their current sentiment toward SKG? If we don't know, should we contact them for a statement?

To my understanding the SKG movements main goal is to make it so all video-games are legally required to have an end of life plan making them theoretically indeffinate, as it is argued that to not have such a plan violates consumer rights.

What is don't understand is how this is a violation of consumer rights. From what i know, when you buy a game you are purchasing either: a physical piece of storage containing the games software; a digital copy of said software; or a licence to remotely access the game. Doesn't this mean that even if the game requires external support to play, removing the external support is not in of itself illegal, as you neither purchased it not were(typicaly) explicitly protest indefinate support.

I ask this out of genuine curiosity because from the information i have on hand it feels as if the SKG movement is born out of an entitlement to something false, because something they enjoyed was legally but unfortunately made inaccessible to them, which I really wish to believe is not true.

I already know two things:

EU Commission doesn't necessarily affect laws outside of Europe.

These laws can take a few months to over a year to pass.

So here are my questions:

1. If it does pass, would it impact gaming in the US (as I am not European and I want to know if this would affect gaming in other countries as well.)

2. Is it possible to fight against it if it does pass?

3. Would european indie developers have to move to america just to publish their game?

4. Would it actually kill gaming as a whole if it does pass?

Edit: I meant to type Commission my bad

I have been hearing a bunch of things about this, with a few people saying that the whole thing has been blown out of proportion, so is there any proof that the act isn't THAT bad?

Edit; I recommend omend that you should read the actual act first (specifically article 15) so that you can make a conclusion before commenting.

PSA: I originally posted this on r/playstation a few mins ago, and it unceremoniously got removed shortly after a discussion started, so im posting it here just for discussions sake.

Pretty much as the title states, considering that the PS store is available in only 70ish countries, what happens to the rest of the world that relies on proxy accounts and location spoofing?

Of course you can still do that, but thats more so the ingenuity of people and a way to circumvent Sony’s abysmal availability across the globe.

If the plan is all digital after 2028 then there should be a clear cut plan to expand the availability on Sony services to the majority of countries.

What are your thoughts on this?

Even if with they don't disclose the source code?

just sell it!

And the price can be high.

Or, the sold server app can have a coherent player limit (based on expected simultaneous multiplayer interactions) to lower the price to a value that makes sense for the player that intends to host a small server.

It could be like 10 users for LAN license.

It could be 1 user and very cheap if you just want to play offline single player mode.

and don't mess with us!

And don't they dare to release the server app so messed that the playability becomes degraded... The law must enforce to keep the quality: or they release the original server app or they remove just enough without destroying our experience.

our dreamssss

Because to trash our money (and our dreams... Our DREAMSsssss) is absurd!

I never more bought anything that is online only, to not get to like it and BOOM it is suddenly gone.

Business man don't love games as we do. They are on it only for the money. If they ever played a game publicly, it was fake! They don't understand they are destroying what keeps us happy, and still they want us to shutup!

a promoting site

We need a site promoting "never ending safe games to buy so you can get attached to forever" that have at least a LAN mode option (that is equivalent to offline if no-one else joins).

Further arguments and alternatives:

Fully Functional server executable without only the database secrets to prevent other devs coping the unique hidden ideas.

No need to exactly release the server app to the public but the server should be reactivatable by player's paying for it's uptime

A promise to keep the server up for at least like 1 year after you purchase. Stop selling if there are shutdown plans or otherwise devs will have to refund by law. Read here.

Context: A girl sued Meta for causing social media addiction, and the company barely processed the lawsuit. Meta will have to pay $1.4 billion, including therapy fees for the emotional and mental damage caused. That girl will have $1.4 billion, and Meta had to pay the best psychologist in the world for her therapy.

My opinion, and it might upset many, is that the industry should be perfectly fine because I've seen gamers and content creators who play for more than 12 hours without regulation, like the Destiny fandom. They've used their addiction to Destiny, and if you tell them to look for a job, they harass and block you. I know this post might upset many, but the truth is, this should be done to the video game industry, especially to Riot Games, Epic Games, Ubisoft, Valve, Activision, and EA, because their games like League of Legends, Valorant, Fortnite, Overwatch, Dota 2, Call of Duty, Apex Legends, among others, have players who are addicted all day long. And no offense, but given the current state of the industry, there's an addiction, not a passion. They're stressed and worried that sooner or later they might develop diabetes, cholesterol problems, and various health issues, including mental health problems.

With another huge set of layoffs from Xbox today it’s got me wondering, when will we actually hold them accountable for this. It’s weird seeing everyone so upset about the PlayStation disc situation (which they have every right to be upset about), but we don’t see some huge movement against Xbox to stop with this insane firing and closures of some absolutely amazing studios. Even after this new set of layoffs got announced, I barely see anything about how absolutely insane this is, this situation is as bad or maybe even worse than the disc situation. Xbox is absolutely the killer of so many great studios and developers and are single handedly ruining gaming because of their greed and terrible mismanagement.

I’ve been digging into the proposed EU KIDS ACT and trying to figure out what it means for indie online games. It’s not law yet — it’s a Commission proposal going through the ordinary legislative procedure — but if it passes roughly as drafted, it could reshape how small studios approach online features, live-service mechanics, and modding.

I’m not a lawyer. This is just a summary of what I’ve read and the questions it raises. Curious what other devs think.

Is stuff like this the norm nowadays? Like it's bad enough if Krafton is just doing the 'industry standard' but it would be worse if they were one of the outliers.

https://subnautica.com/en/policy/tos

So if this goes through, developers are supposed to leave games in a playable state...

That means developers are supposed to create the means to do that. What about the cost of creating those tools? What if there are developers right now that are giving up on making cool online games just because of this?

Hello everyone.

It's a pleasure to be here. I have had this lingering question in the back of my mind for a long while now. Since the Stop Killing Games movement is gaining momentum in the EU and in California, I have wondered about the likes of Steam since it is the largest hub of offering video games with the base games and DLCs and what not.

If this gets passed in the States (which I believe most likely it will), what do you guys predict with the likeabouts of Steam since they are game developers as well (even though they haven't put anything out in years)? Will our libraries be saved (most likely)?

The reason I ask this is because I want to keep buying more games on Steam, but GOG has been my main go-to for a couple of months now. It just stinks to think about that you own absolutely nothing in your Steam library that one paid money for (even though it is in bold print when you buy something).

I am glad that there is alternatives like GOG available to help connect the feeling of owning what you buy again.

Thank you for your time and consideration in this matter. Have a blessed morning/afternoon/evening when you see this message.

They discontinued this collection a long time ago. Can they make it stop working someday?

EDIT:- THANK YOU! Everyone who commented I have enough much needed input to go on with more then I could have wished, sorry if missed anyone cant wait to be on board, I appreciate you all regardless

So following all the news in regards to DRM and how that affects me as a consumer had me decide to basically give any platform the 🖕🏼 going forward, which for me mainly playstation as have 1-5.

I decided to bite the bullet and ordered a PC build, in place of what would have been next gen playstation and accessories, at little more cost but savings should be made going forward I am led to believe, now does anyone know where I should go for future/existing games and what can I use to be able to use a controller, whilst attempting to relearn mouse and keyboard, painfully if at all 😂.

Rather is GoG the only Storefront where I am mainly safe from future removal, or is it safe for now to use that as well as steam/epic and can you link them in anyway to other platforms, sorry I do not understand well enough all the finer details with gaming on PC in regards to DRM and everything so hopefully someone who uses a PC and maybe a console too can help here.

I got specs to suit light gaming AMD Ryzen 7 8700f 8 core

A620M Motherboard

16GB+ DDR5 5200MHz

FAST 1TB M.2 NVMe SSD

12GB Nvidia RTX 5070 Graphics

300mbps Wifi and Gb lan

and basic keyboard and mouse all the controllers I have from console just I do not know next steps, sub to psn cancel no renewal, and no more purchases of games going forward unless known as no risk of removal.

Please remove if this is not ok to ask, seemed right in regards to DRM though as helped make a tough decision, sooner than wished, but ensures will stick to my guns so to speak.

I check news occasionally but after hearing they lost the californian game act, failed getting any following on canada, got dropped by the eu parlement due to lobbyist and just bad news in general, is it still ongoing? Is there still some hopium I can inject in my vain?

Also since im moving to otawa it would be kind if someone could tell me what I can do to try and push the campain further

The core idea behind the Stop Killing Games movement is to have clear End-of-Life (EOL) terms in a game’s Terms of Service and some form of continued access after shutdown. This is reasonable. However, I think a lot of people misunderstand what they’re actually asking for when they say things like “let us connect to unofficial servers” or “give us the ability to run our own servers.” Like it’s some simple feature request.

Servers contain core game logic, progression systems, economies, anti-cheat, and persistent data. 

Enabling players to run their own servers would, in many cases, require exposing proprietary server code, internal tooling, and database structures if they still want to play the account they had. That introduces serious concerns around security risks for the company complying with this.

It’s difficult to see proposals like that making it through any serious technical or legal review.

A more realistic expectation is something like an offline mode post-EOL, where the game can run locally without reliance on server infrastructure. This would require developers to design games with both offline and online pathways from the outset, something we already see in titles like those from FromSoftware. (Dark souls 1-3 etc.)

The push for player run servers often comes from comparisons to private servers, particularly in games like World of Warcraft. But those examples are frequently misunderstood. Private servers typically exist because of extensive reverse engineering, which includes packet sniffing, protocol reconstruction, and other legally questionable methods just to approximate server behavior. Even then, they are imperfect replicas, often plagued by bugs, and broken quests.

This is the issue I have with all of this, and perhaps someone can talk sense to me and help me see why this wouldn’t be an issue, and maybe that I’m misguided to some degree. How would we feasibly get to “run our own servers” or have them “hand us the servers”? 

Before what im going to say, i hate LLMs and generative AI as anyone ever could, but with recent discovery how its capable of copying and modifying games it opens a window to preservation via cloning, which a new venture for piracy. Why cant this argument be used to show publishers that cooperation with SKG goal can help them too? I hate the thought of playing an AI replica of a game and i absolutely dislike this trend, but i also hate not being able to play games i loved (and paid for), now having this idea lingering. While clone builds made with AI are crappy, awfully unoptimized, unscalable and without enough iterations feel like a fever dream, it just might be if not now but in near future a better option to heavy regulations governors propose and limited rights license publishers offer.

In short: AI, despite how shitty it is, might offer a better service publishers provide.

Edit: i am not saying that AI is our solution, jesus christ. I'm against it, very much. My point is about negative impact it can and will show on both games quality for users and games sales for publishers if they keep going against SKG goals.