its not like Mina is provoking him and he does a comeback, he just randomly shows up at her house and set fire to her closet unprompted just because he didn't think her drip slays
Calico also clocked his tea by telling him "between us girlies"๐ญ
Lowkey, catty fashion diva gay dating a jolly wholesome bear like Kelvin is a really interesting combo. Can't wait for us to get more insight on their lore and know WHY they ended it
Now this is just an educated guess, but: Seven was studying the astral gates, Kelvin was planning and expedition to the new gate, Kelvin has a Baroness line about how he "Pushed Ettrick away for his ambition"....
He probably denied Ettrick/Seven a spot on the expedition in a... probably less than ideal way. (What with Seven talking about how he was "betrayed" and such)
Kelvin believes he is the only one who survived the expedition
He only survived because of the big rock on his back, which he doesn't understand
Everyone else died of unknown causes
Seven has studied the gates extensively, Kelvin seemingly has not
What if that stone can do a lot more than just keep Kelvin alive? Was Seven on the expedition too, saw the stone, knew what it was, wanted it enough to kill everyone for it, but couldn't get away with the stone for whatever reason? Seven flees, his crimes are discovered, gets sent to Lost Whisper? "Went on a killing spree to try to steal an exceptionally powerful magical thing to become a god" seems like a pretty good reason to obliterate someone's soul.
The only real plot hole I'm seeing there is how no one else would know about this. Seems like the sort of thing that would make the news. The 'betrayal' could be simply Kelvin refusing to let Seven take it, at least. But it does explain what Seven did to end up in prison in the first place. Totally possible that part's entirely unrelated to Kelvin, though.
If we're going with the idea that Seven is Kelvins old friend Ettrick: I find it hard to believe Seven ever went on the arctic expedition. Geist and Kelvin have a line about Ettrick "causing a scene" at the fundraiser for the expedition. That, with the "pushing Ettrick away for his ambition" Baronness line, along with the Archmother line of Sevens "destiny was denied to [him]" and "[his] lover trying to steal it for themselves" type stuff...
As for what he got arrested for... I think it's implied that he might not've killed anyone, but definitely knew something that the government(s) couldn't let get out, since they tried to obliterate his soul so no one could ever raise/contact him after death. Once again just making an Educated Guess, but considering Seven is the #1 in the Dynamo Fan Club, and Dynamo was ALSO researching the Gates, maybe he was trying to reverse engineer/improve on whatever happened to Dynamo when Dynamo first made contact with the Gate 50 years back. Which would explain why he'd want to get to the Gate in the arctic so bad.
They completed a lot of unfinished conversations that were otherwise onesided. Apollo responding to vyper wanting to marry him and kill his dad was in the game, but now vyper actually saying that is there too.
This conversation has been in the game for a long time now, but only seven's side. Calico's side actually makes it interesting lmao
Itโs heavily implied the Kelvin we know and the Kelvin that existed before he died/got revived were two very different people in terms of outlook, personality and ego
He also tells viper that "a knife can only hurt your enemy when they are Infront of you but knowledge can hurt them from anywhere" so that's presumably why he's testing what others react to.
It's just a generally expensive jacket. In canon it's from a fashion designer called Kelsey Evans, and that line is mentioned by various members of the more affluent cast. It's an "oh you've got MONEY money" jacket that only the very wealthy would even be able to recognize at a glance
It's less that the jacket is supernatural (though it obviously is) and more a giveaway to the rich that Pocket is not the homeless shmuck they're masquerading as.
Iโm not even joking when I say seven is one of the best gay characters Iโve seen in fiction. To make a menacing terrifying character that also has a sassy bitchy side is so good, so entertaining, and so unique
I love how all these comments are trying to start shit for OP pointing out Seven being a lil fruity and very sassy. Like, yeah sure it's a stereotype but as seemingly one of the few actual gay guys commenting, sometimes the shoe fits and that's okay!
The problem with stereotyping is if we assume a trait shared by some members of a population is accurate for ALL members of that population. That doesn't mean anyone that acts close to that stereotype (which, holy fuck, imagine thinking Seven is a stereotype for gay people lmao) is inherently problematic, even in media, and especially when that character shows so many non-stereotypical traits that make them a person!
As someone the kind of guy people usually pick up on being gay because of my mannerisms. Seeing the shoe fit on a well written character is kind of a relief.
Seven having his queen moments while being a multifaceted character is awesome. I can't remember the last time I saw a game character that is flamboyant and not a joke character/ one dimensional.
Im not saying his not gay, i actually believe he is. But assuming someone sexuality just because they're interested in fashion is a asshole, toxic masculinity move.
I agree with you but I think this is more like a popular fan theory people already like and want to be true and just using this is evidence to project on to that
I highly doubt people would call seven gay if this was legit the ONLY thing he had
There's a lot of other dialogue that indicates he's gay, particularly all his stuff about Kelvin when taken in context with the announcer line about him being betrayed by a lover. (Presuming of course that he is Ettrick)
While you're right, I do enjoy a character who embraces their stereotype, as long as that's not the only representation of them, and Seven is absolutely not the only queer person in this game
I get what you're trying to say but beyond seven saying this in a super sassy way that is undeniably not straight, fashion culture especially runway culture (especially for the men) is inseparable from queer culture as a whole, to be involved in it is inherently pretty fruity by design, men being interested in run way fashion in specific is like historical red herring for a men being queer in someway, and even if he was a straight man, I really dont think someone invested in fashion culture like that would be bothered all that much by being called gay if they weren't. Also, seven is not a real person
The response from queer people to these lines has mostly been โdamn heโs queening out, I love himโ so I think youโre tilting at windmills here a bit
Queer people trying to label anyone based in stereotypes is toxic aswell. Being queer doesnt make anyone automatically non-toxic, queer people can be shit people too.
So uhhh who gets to decide what's 'toxic' and what isn't? Funny your beliefs/code of conduct happens to be the correct, non-toxic one.
Meanwhile I'm just seeing people having fun with voice lines and stereotypes while you're screeching about what a morally superior person you are for not associating fashion with gayness.
This thread is pretty much proof that some people will not accept anything other than the character literally saying "I am a homosexual and I am interested in other men, romantically. This is not a joke or sarcasm, this is me coming out."
This is like thinking The Matrix is straight. "Take this pill, be reborn and wear leather." Type shit.
The one guy I know who is ridiculously into fashion and goes to fashion shows is 100% straight. Means nothing, but if it was just a fun joke from op it is pretty funny.
Idk man maybe it's the combined elements of this zesty ass lamp man who parries by throwing it back and is stated to have lost everything because of his lover while also accusing another male character (who is said to smell like him) of making him lose everything, also saying this shit. And the new Calico dialogue.
We already know this dude is gay, it's not a harmful stereotype to go "this dialogue is even gayer than him being gay" when talking about the obviously gay character. We all knew it already it's all in good fun.
Why do people insist on playing dumb about this shit as a "gotcha" you literally have a pride flag in your pfp you know what you're doing.
Can you please read OPs title? This isn't being considered in a vacuum, this is literally the least obfuscated his sexuality has been compared to the rest of his dialogue. Yes the stereotype is bad, but in this case, look at this for what it is lmao
youre the one who called that Kelvin dialogue less relevant than fashion comments in the title you're pointing to??? Time to walk it back as an "ironic unironic" title amiright OP?
Oh my goddd yall are genuinely insufferable. seven has already been confirmed as gay since OGNB and to think this post was said completely seriously and that im just walking it back is wildddd.
Obviously i do not seriously believe that the archmommy talking about seven's ex lover who's obviously kelvin is lesser evidence than him being into fashion.
HOWEVER, I am serious about the fact having a character in the 1900s know about fashion (an industry dominated by gay men) and talk about in a catty way is a pretty textbook example of queer coding.
In the real world, gay people know what non-gay people think a gay person acts and talks like and we lean into or away from that based on the context. For example, when i feel comfortable I speak with a fagcent and when I'm worried about being hatecrimed I drop my voice 7 octaves (this is codeswitching which is different sure but you get what i mean).
Writers who have had that experience in a similar way will put dialogue like the one here of seven gagging mina in a discussion on fashion to say to the reader or in this context listener 'this character is queer'.
Or maybe read the comment I was replying to? Did you realize that I was replying to the comment above and didn't say I disagreed about Kelvin and Seven being gay...? I literally just thought it was funny that the previous comment mentioned how being men being fashionable implied anything about their sexuality.
Itโs pretty clearly not just this lol, like that alone would be toxic but myself and many other gay people have been calling seven a queen for awhile
To make a presumption isnโt inherently toxic. I think most people would agree that this line would make you wonder if seven might be gay. He might not be. Who gives a shit. It aint toxic to think this suggests it though.
Straight communities on the internet when queercoding exists: โ๏ธโ๏ธโ๏ธ um, actually, that's a harmful stereotype, sexuality has nothing to do with behaviour!! Stop pushing your harmful views onto everyone! ๐ก๐ก๐ก
Gay communities on the internet when queercoding exist: OMG HE'S JUST LIKE ME FR ๐๐๐ LOVE THIS FRUITY DIVA, I SHIP IT SO MUCH ๐ THANK YOU DEVS PLS KEEP SERVING ๐๐๐
In seriousness, I am queer and I've literally never seen actual queer people get mad about well executed queercoding lmao. It's always straight people who are inexplicably triggered coz they hate subtext I guess???
(But only when it's gay subtext lmaoooo. Straight romantic subtext is taken at face value, gay people aren't allowed to be gay unless they turn to the camera and completely and unambiguously declare 'I am homosexual'. It just comes off as very desperate and people saying 'GUYS PLEASE LISTEN HE COULD STILL BE STRAIGHT!!
....' as if Valve isn't physically located in a very rainbow area and 100% has #woke leftie rainbow employees working on this project, as best evidenced by the overt queerness of Pocket and Vyper and the coding of Celeste and Vindicta, among other characters!)
TLDR: There are zero non-homophobic reasons to deny mean gamer gays of their evil-but-fabulous representation lmao
I don't think anyone is getting upset about "queercoding". They're getting upset because saying someone is xyz because they like abc is weird af and extremely toxic.
That's literally what queercoding is! It's giving a character social or cultural indicators, such as how they dress or what they like to do, which point towards a certain group without having to state group membership outright.ย
It first started conceptually in the era where comic book characters weren't allowed to be gay and so we're made subtextually gay instead, and to this day still exists because coding is a REAL thing.
It's not unfair to say that stereotypes exist for a reason and that they can indicate, if not group membership outright, what groups a person is likely to NOT be a part of. A man
who LOVES drag race is highly unlikely to be a bible bashing conservative, for example. Being effeminate is not something only gay men are allowed to do, but the vast majority of men who are openly effiminate are gay precisely BECAUSE it's normalised in that community and not othersย
I'm gay myself but a man being sassy doesn't mean they're gay. All this does is reinforce stereotypes and very toxic masculinity.
Don't get me wrong, it's great to include diversity of personality, especially a sassy one that many gay people can relate to. But it does not "confirm" that seven is gay.
I mean unless some dialogue contradicts it, he still needs to eat, so presumably he still has a butt. Which means so long as Seven is a bottom he and Kelvin should still be able to make it work.
He's gay as in like. "My friend of many years who I held as my beloved Companion. A bond that is unmatched in any other soul. And an intellect, a cunning that amazes even the Shrewd mind. Is no more but a husk. and he broke my heart. He must pay.----
-- bitch yo clothes was ass gtfo the stage mina---
I don't like this kind of thinking. The queer movement is partially about getting rid of gender roles and such. So when you say that a guy who's into fashion must be gay, or all gay guys know fashion, you're not helping anything.
The idea that gender roles need to be gotten rid of is specifically post modernism in terms of queer activism.
While we can talk about needing to get rid of gender roles they still exist and everyone has been influenced by them. Gay men in that same way are socialised and writers use those notations to code characters as to say theyre gay without saying it.
Or gay writers write gay characters in a way that matches their own personality (usually something writers do in general) instead of generalizing that most gay people act the same way as you and many others are doing here.
Maybe I'm not thinking straight right now because of lack of sleep (I haven't slept for over 24 hours)
But how does this dialogue prove that Seven is gay? Bro was just complaining about Mina's clothes.
iโve for sure seen at least every female character in some gay fan art bro lmao like with silvers new voice lines implying she fucked the blue guy, top comment on that post was like โlesbian 9/11โ or something
Seven is just an extremely intelligent person that loves making people squirm, or feel less than, I think he just said that because he knew it would hurt
I mean yeah it's cool. Valve is good at portraying nuance and it's cool that's he's not "The gay villain!" but rather the evil undead god complex murder mage who also dabbles in sassy comebacks and fashion shows. His sexuality is being treated as a background character trait he just happens to have, his preference is not even relevant to how his story pans out despite his romance being central to it. Imo that's a lot better representation than what other games are doing, where they're afraid to give minority characters disagreeable traits and represent them by having "i cant wait to get home to my gay lover who is the same gender as me" ass dialogue
While yes, I do think Seven might be gay, I'm unsure if this is him being a fashionista. He's shown to do his homework on his lane mate and probably all the ritualists, so he may have just seen and heard what the world thought of her last collections and is using it to v be an asshole.
All the new Seven dialogue is genuinely so funny. They took like a 90 degree turn on his character from serial killer with a god complex to gay criminal
1.5k
u/Lonely-Aardvark3377 Vyper 17d ago
Hitting her right where it hurtsโฆow