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u/Luutamo 1d ago
I think this comic might be too American for me to understand
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u/-non-existance- 1d ago
There are usually 2 kinds of paid leave (Paid Time Off) in the US: sick and vacation. Sick leave is an allotment of days where you can call in sick and still get paid. Vacation leave is the same but for vacations.
Until recently, there was an expectation that when you leave a job, your unused PTO would get lumped into your last paycheck.
As you can imagine, corpos have started clawing back that money. This is also egregious since corpos do everything they can to deny that leave in the first place ("You're not sick, you can still work." "Someone already is taking off that week so you can't. No I don't care that you already paid for it.")
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u/Fun_General_6407 1d ago
Why are you living in Cyberpunk without the chrome, neon and Akira motorbikes to make it bareable?
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u/Ghost-Writer 1d ago
Because we were taught non violent protesting would solve all our problems while the upper class sic their dogs on us.
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u/Lastoutcast123 23h ago
Someone forgot to tell the upper class “those who make peaceful revolution impossible, make violent revolution inevitable”
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u/Tricky-Ad7897 22h ago
Yeah well that theory is being actively challenged in the US lol.
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u/stop-calling-me-fat 22h ago
Most armed country in the world living under rising fascism and being forced into pointless wars while they don’t even get healthcare. “Shrugs”
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u/GreenCyborgNinjaDude 22h ago
Most armed country includes the military and the racist bootlickers who voted the fashies in. Violent revolution would end in civil war where the world’s most well funded military (with massive civilian surveillance infrastructure ever since the PATRIOT act) took a side against it.
Quite frankly it would simply lead to a lot of death and the fascists no longer having a resistance.
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u/purplezart 21h ago
the fascists no longer having a resistance.
wasn't that the problem that started this thread?
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u/GreenCyborgNinjaDude 20h ago
Not caused by the people of the country, but the politicians who sold them out to the highest bidder, and the system they built to keep their corrupt kind in power.
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u/breaducate 22h ago
That's why they're pushing full surveillance now that the tech is more or less there and pushing to make everything you do on a computer tied to an ID.
A society-wide panopticon requires too many watchers, until you can automate that sort of thing.
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u/Special_Cicada6968 21h ago
This is why I'm so against AI. It's being built out to create that panopticon that will make it easy for them to start policing thought. Same with the flock and other recognition cameras.
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u/SirBertrandMacguffin 21h ago
They know. That's why they're building bunkers and stockpiling arms and investing so heavily in keeping the population fractured on pointless cultural lines. If they can stop people from working together it's impossible to revolt peacefully or violently.
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u/_whatever_wherever 18h ago edited 17h ago
How do you think black people got civil rights?
The upper class were presented with a clear choice, endorce MLK's views and peaceful integration, or deal with the likes of Malcom X and the Black Panthers who were more than happy to use violence to enforce their rights
Fuck, the final straw being the riots after the murder of MLK, it became clear the choice was rights or violence
(This is of course a MASSIVE oversimplification, the views and positions of MLK and Malcolm X shifted massively during their lives, as did their tactics and methods)
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u/AberdeenPhoenix 23h ago
If we don’t take action now
We’ll settle for nothing later
We settle for nothing now
And we’ll settle for nothing later
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u/gadgaurd 22h ago
Which raises the question: Who's gonna get publicly shredded by the police first? Because that's what's gonna happen the minute the American public starts doing something genuinely effective. Pretty sure we all know that, even if most of us don't wanna say it. If shit gets violent the police won't hesitate to mow citizens down.
Mind you, I don't disagree with you at all. Just pointing out why no one's made a move yet. Everyone knows the score.
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u/World_of_Warshipgirl 21h ago
120 schoolchildren in Iran are not the first to get shredded by the US government, nor will they be the last while USA's own citizen do nothing.
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u/Timehacker-315 22h ago
because US police have embraced "it's only a war crime if it happens during a war"
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u/waxisfun 23h ago
It already happened, but spread out separately from 1950-1990s. Motorcycle gangs, chrome surfaces, and neon lights happened just not at the same time.
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u/Axiluvia 1d ago
Because trying to move to a different country is a complete pain, can take years, and/or be too expensive to afford.
Not to mention if you're LGBTQ+ (especially the T part anymore) it limits what countries you can move to, and each one of those have their own rules about moving there that you may or may not fit.
Seriously, my wife and I have been looking at options since 2020...
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u/not-bread 23h ago
If you want an honest answer, it’s because they live in the richest country in the world. Salaries are high so people have been content for decades, they still mostly enjoy a high quality of life. This connectedness has allowed the wealthy to accumulate incredible power and undermine workers rights, solidarity, and democracy.
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u/DarkBladeMadriker 23h ago
Plus structuring the whole system in a way that if I say fuck it and go out to protest with a bag of cocktails, my family will definitely go homeless/hungry within a couple weeks. Hell, that could happen even if I just got unjustly arrested and shuffled around while the try to figure out the "paperwork errors" that prevent me from getting out of holding even if i didnt actually do shit.
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u/nerdured95 23h ago
Best we could do was late stage capitalism, rampant violence, and domestic terrorism /s
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u/Kagahami 1d ago
It's also worth noting that many white collar jobs are instituting "unlimited PTO" which means, by their description, you can take time off as you need.
What they don't specify is that you still need to get this PTO approved and it will only be approved as time allows.
And time never allows.
And since you aren't actually accruing PTO, there's no liability and nothing to pay out if the person leaves the company.
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u/gyroda 23h ago
Also, on average, people take less time off with these policies. Even ignoring the problem with needing to request it, there's no guidance there on how much you can/should take off.
I live in the UK. Holiday here has a legal minimum but it's use it or lose it - it ensured that I actually take it off so it doesn't go to waste (I can carry over 5 days, per company policy). It's also a requirement that my employer allows me that time off - if I wanted to take all of December off they could tell me no, that's not reasonable, but they can't deny it all year long.
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u/miicah 22h ago
Holiday here has a legal minimum but it's use it or lose it
That seems illegal too? In Australia annual leave builds up, which usually is only a problem for those people who literally never take leave and have some sort of unholy balance and are forced to use it up so the company doesn't have to pay it out in a huge lump sum.
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u/mawarup 21h ago
it’s legal, but if the company were found to be preventing staff from taking the statutory amount of leave, they would get in trouble. they’re obliged to allow you to take time off, they’re not obliged to actually force you to or to pay you a bonus in lieu of taking time off.
in practice most companies want to avoid even looking like they don’t let people take statutory leave, so they repeatedly and strongly encourage you to book it over and over again until you do.
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u/Jester1525 23h ago
There is a Canadian company that posts on tik tok that has unlimited time off but has a 3 week minimum on it.. Which is actually pretty cool. They actually want to give their staff the time they need.
Most unlimited pto scams are just designed to screw employees.
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u/Kagahami 23h ago
Yeah, as an accountant, them ensuring the 3 week minimum means they're still taking a liability and not just using it to avoid costs. That's more responsible.
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u/ve2dmn 22h ago
They might *have* to give that 3 weeks by law, but it really depends on the province and the amount of time you have worked at that company. (2 weeks is the minimum across the country, but places like Saskatchewan starts at 3weeks)
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u/gramathy 1d ago
In California vacation time is legally wages and cannot be clawed back. Sick time, however, is not.
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u/Gallifrey685 1d ago
My boss managed to avoid the legally required sick days that are given at the start of the year by rolling sick time and vacation time into the same PTO policy which is accrued every pay period.
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u/gramathy 23h ago
Hey if they're doing that it means the sick time can't be denied when you quit. He basically decided to shoot himself in the foot with wages in order to deny you like three hours of early sick time every year
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u/dtb1987 1d ago
Same in Virginia, anytime I have ever been laid off I got all of my PTO. In fact last time I was laid off I had 600+ hours of PTO, I bought a new car because mine was dying and had money left over
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u/Pittsbirds 23h ago
It's so cool and fun how we have all our basic workers' rights split between state borders so some people just have a worse quality of life for absolutley no reason lmao
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u/Tablesalt2001 23h ago
Wait so you have a set amount of days for you to be sick? What if I'm still sick do I just magically become healed?
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u/jarviscumstein 23h ago
This is the best part. Then you can apply for "donated leave" which HR must approve. The catch is that your fellow employees can't donate their sick leave.
They can only donate the few types of paid non-sick leave like vacation or comp time that they have.
Some liberal states have state supported programs that can supplement you if you have an injury or illness or short term disability, but they don't pay your full wage and are of limited duration.
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u/Safe_Award_785 22h ago
Wait, if you are sick for a longer time your colleagues are asked to give up their leave? That is insane.
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u/VanAndelon 1d ago
Thanks for the explanation.
I am so shocked how the people in the freaking richest country of the world ended up letting corps stew them so hard. In Europe streets would be burning - literally...
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u/ThatGuyCG12 23h ago
That's the trick, the citizens arent the holders of those riches, theyre the ones that got exploited so others could become rich. Its ok though cuz theyre the "richest" country
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u/ImTheZapper 23h ago
Ya instead of using raw economic power, comparing median QOL metrics puts america at best in the middle of the pack of the 3 dozen or so fully developed nations on earth, and more realistically near the back of that pack.
Its a good country to be in for the top ~15% of the population, and thats it. It exponentially increases in being "good" as you climb that 15%.
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u/Capraos 23h ago
Because America is large and decentralized. Want to protest the Capitol in a European country? Take the day off and drive a couple hours to the Capitol and block the limited pathways and roads.
Want to do that in America? Take at least two weeks off, drive for at least a day and at most a week or so, then go block streets that are easy to get around and don't really have any strategic advantage.
There isn't a person or building we can take out, as again, power is decentralized. Taking out one person or group, there's hundreds more spread throughout the country that are constantly changing locations. Think taking over the Capitol Building and holding it will do, ask January 6thers how that went for them.
Americans are constantly having protest. Our protest are often bigger than even Europe's largest ever protest. But to actually change things, you'd need to get at least 30% of the population to all work in unity, at the same time, and have a workers strike. Which would end up in a lot of bloodshed as that's what the powers that be do when we start being effective. We're not quite ready to pull that lever yet. We're trying this voting thing one more time. If it doesn't work, we all agree the system is fucked and start taking more drastic measures.
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u/copperhead2313 23h ago
You mean the country founded on Protestant ideals? The ideals that value spending as much time as possible working as a moral obligation? And choosing to spend time on leisure as a moral failing?
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u/Mikomics 23h ago
Oof. I work in Europe and it's a similar system, except that sick days are always on the cost of the employer (but you need a doctor's note). After a certain point, health insurance takes over and it's not on the employer anymore.
Where I work we also don't pay back vacation days that weren't used, but we approve 99% of vacation requests and it's very explicitly stated that you need to use them up before your contract ends. Only those who never read their contract and don't pay attention during onboarding miss it and that's on them.
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u/Teripid 23h ago
The real fun was when places just started offering unlimited PTO / sick.. which basically means the same amount or less and they can still just deny. Now clearly you can't just vanish randomly but it never means MORE PTO, just no tracking of a balance.
AND don't have to pay out when you leave because there isn't a that formal balance tracked.
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u/toasterb 22h ago
Man, I'm glad I got out of the states and moved to Canada. So many awful things that I took for granted as normal can actually be better.
My current job has unlimited sick time, no note needed, and started with eight weeks of vacation (yes, I get a bit more than most Canadians, but it's still awesome.)
We've been here for 13 years and had two kids — now 11 and 8 — and I think as a family, we've spent about $100 total on healthcare costs that weren't reimbursed. And there have been some serious health concerns included in that time!
My kids' schools are so stress-free compared to what I see from parents in the states. Just about all of the schools are fine, so there's no moving or angling to get into a specific school. There's no discussion about test scores at all. My kids get over an hour of outdoor time every day and there's no homework other than classwork they can't get to in time. We don't even have to shop for school supplies. We just pay $30 or so at the beginning of the school year and everything is provided.
There are a lot of things that could use improving here, but man, I'm so glad I don't have to deal with shit in the U.S. anymore.
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u/Successful-Medicine9 1d ago
This is generalized, but in most states (if not all) paid time off falls under two categories: vacation/holiday and sick. They accrue and are tracked separately. Vacation time must be paid out if an employee leaves or is fired. Sick time is not paid out. Some workplaces allow you to "donate" your sick time to a colleague that needs it but otherwise it is not transferable or paid out.
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u/imahugemoron 23h ago
The sick time donation thing is so beyond the pale too
Boss: “hey everyone please donate your sick time so that your coworker with cancer who has run out of sick time doesn’t have to get fired and also so the rest of you aren’t able to take time off when you need!”
“Well can’t you just give them the time off? They have cancer FFS!”
Either that or it’s so the person can continue getting paid rather than being given unpaid time off, that’s our society that if anything happens to you, often times you get screwed by the medical bills and screwed a second time while your bills and rent pile up on top of it because you aren’t getting paid or were fired.
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u/ssnowangelz 1d ago
You get certain amounts of ‘PTO’ and ‘sick leave’, which are separate from one another.
It’s common for unused PTO to be paid back to you, but it’s rarer to find a company willing to pay your unused sick leave. Sick leave often ‘disappears,’ and you start over after a certain amount of time at some places.
So if you have a bunch of sick leave nearing expiration (that won’t be paid out), you’ve gotta fake sick & take that time off. Or you lose it forever.
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u/PacificNWdaydream 23h ago
No one in the USA accrues this amount of sick leave at work. I am American and I frankly don’t understand it.
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u/ipuio 22h ago
Federal employees get 4 hours every two weeks with no cap. My boss has over 700 hours since he’s worked for the feds for just over 10 years and pretty much never uses sick leave
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u/Silent-Act191 22h ago
You already lost me at the concept of accumulating sick leave hours to be honest.
So you just don't get paid when you're sick past your accumulated hours?
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u/Saigaface 22h ago
lol not only that, you often get fired, unless protected by the family medical leave act. But that only goes up to 12 weeks I think and then even that protection goes away.
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u/grundleHugs 23h ago
Work for county government. Sick leave accrues at constant rate and never expires. Worked there 8.5 years. Had to use it all 2 years in for a broken leg on short term disability. Im back up to 550 hours or something.
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u/Ill-Dependent2976 1d ago
They just got me with this. Told me in person they'd cash out on sick, which I took note of because it's unusual, then they screwed me in the actual paperwork.
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u/That_Mad_Scientist 1d ago
This is why you get everything in writing, don't accept offers before you have the contract before your eyes, and UNIONIZE if you can. Spoken words are completely worthless. Who's going to be able to prove it? You certainly won't.
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u/Ill-Dependent2976 1d ago
It was never on the table, my agreement was never relevant, they just lied to me to make themselves feel better when they went home for the day.
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u/mewfahsah 20h ago
I was interviewing for a new job and one of my stipulations was a four day work week. They agreed verbally but didn't include it in their offer letter. I mentioned this and they got very defensive, almost aggressive. They had also mentioned working five days a week as I got trained up, the red flags were clear they were going to try and bait and switch me. Towards the end they said I had to trust them, well I simply told them I have zero reason to trust you, hence why I want it in writing.
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u/thing-amajig 22h ago
My last municipal job did this. The handbook wasn't clear so I asked hr in person and they said yes, then after I left they told me it doesn't get paid out due to some law back in 2013 that I guess I'm supposed to just know. Fuck that place. The most untalented, unprofessional, and unhappy people I've ever had the displeasure of working with who all would have gotten fired in 5 minutes in private sector.
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u/FocsSus 14h ago
Yeah no thanks. In Sweden you get paid 80%+ of your salary when you're sick, you stay home to take care of your sick kids, and you don't go back until you're better. If you've got the stomach flu you don't go back until two days after symptoms stop. Plus there's 5-8 weeks of vacation, you get lots of holidays, and if a holiday falls on a Tuesday or Thursday you get the Monday and Friday off too. Wanna talk about the 480 days of paid maternity/paternity leave?
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u/ConflagWex 9h ago
Dude from a medical standpoint that's amazing. In the US so many people work when sick and spread that shit around.
As a human rights standpoint that's also awesome.
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u/LemonKurry 12h ago
Getting Monday and Friday off like that(klämdag) is up to the company policy/collective agreements. Not written in law at all.
Just to be clear about that! But yeah, in non critical jobs it's relatively common.
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u/FocsSus 11h ago edited 11h ago
Sure kinda like the 5 vs 6 weeks of vacation depending on if you're hourly or salary and the 8 weeks depending on if you're working for the government, your age, the company, etc. Getting into the weeds like that when I'm comparing to the US where most people only take/get two weeks. I had a job in the US where I just didn't show up between Christmas and New Years, since why would anyone, and they thought I was not taking the job seriously.
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u/LemonKurry 9h ago
I don't agree that this is getting into the weeds of it.
You wrote 5-8 weeks of vacation. Which is correct enough. 25 days minimum is in the law. But getting a klämdag is not in the law. So it is not always the case.
So I think there's a difference, and was worth pointing out.
But whatever, we do have it quite good here whether one have it or not in their contract! Haha
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u/navlelo_ 12h ago
Similar in Norway. Better with 100% salary during sick leave and during parental leave - although not 480 days which is superior IMO, the kids have a better time in daycare (at 1200NOK/€100 per month) once they’ve celebrated their first birthday.
Amazed that you get to 8 weeks of vacation and holidays on top including vacation on “inneklemt” Mondays/Frifays - is that paid by employers or the government or unpaid?
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u/FocsSus 11h ago
Childcare here is €100 too. When we left the US it was $20,000 for the first kid and a very generous 5% discount for the second kid. It's very tough to stomach the €32,000 reduction in childcare costs here per year. The struggle is so real in Sweden and Norway. /s
Was just in Norway. Amazing country.
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u/wutImiss 1d ago
I've had 1 place pay out sick leave, otherwise "don't use it!" 😤 Why do I have it then???? 🤦♂️
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u/Darkwoth81Dyoni 21h ago
If you get 4 or more hours a month of sick time with unlimited bank, I'd suggest "getting a flu" every autumn for the sake of not having your benefits wasted if you ever change institutes. Obviously don't just waste it all, but over the years most people don't need 48-96 hours of sick leave each year.
And I say this as someone who's typically a die hard overtime/work ethic sorta person.
The system is rigged against people, so we gotta do what we can to take advantage of it.
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u/KAELES-Yt 14h ago
Wait you only get 2 to 4 days of paid sick leave in the states per year*?? And you have to earn it by working??
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u/bahodej 23h ago
If you create a use it or lose it system don't be surprised when it is used.
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u/JakeJascob 22h ago
This my dad's been at the same company for over 25 years and hasn't used much sick time in the last 10 years after me and my siblings graduated so he has like 1800 hours of pto and accrudes like 200-300 more a year because of his position and over time but they'll only pay him out like 80-120 every year and he can only carry over a little 1800 so he ends up taking the last week of the month off 8 months out of the year lol.
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u/DlCKJINGLES6969 22h ago
I work for the state in NC and our sick days never expire, people save them and “retire” early.
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u/DemolitionRED 1d ago
You guys get sick pay?
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u/Rosesandbubblegum 23h ago
I know it's silly, but I feel like qualifying for any kind of sick pay must mean you've got a good-ish job? At every job I've worked it was a battle just to get any kind of unpaid time off. My coworkers would vomit in the bathroom and then go back to work.
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u/diamondmx 21h ago
Or you live in most countries that aren't the US. The US has some of the worst work conditions in the world because you keep voting for people who hate you.
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u/Rosesandbubblegum 19h ago
We can't choose where we live, and most of us didn't vote for this. Our grandparents did (although they enjoyed the system themselves). Now we've inherited it along with a million other problems, and union-busting is something most of our politicians are really good at
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u/Same-Suggestion-1936 17h ago
The people who enjoyed those benefits keep voting against the younger generations having those same benefits*
Fixed. We have two very large voting blocs vying against worker rights interests: the old who always had them, assume they are a given at "good" jobs so it's your fault you don't have benefits because you took a bad job and never applied yourself, or are quite simply out of touch because when you tell them you make $30k a year they say "so what, I did too, still saved for a house, a car, had kids, a retirement fund, and I did it all on bare minimum health insurance, whenever I got hurt I just rubbed dirt in it and didn't cry so hard", and then the remainders of that generation with good jobs down to Gen X and older millennials think the same way sometimes, you have no idea how many people my age I've argued with who say a six figure salary is just enough to make ends meet, or how many people say "so what, if you ever put any work in you wouldn't still be doing THAT job" as of jobs that pay over $50k grow on trees or are willing to hire entry level no relevant education, you could even have a degree in something else you'll be treated same as a fry cook, which isn't even a bad job besides pay. That's why I hate the term "unskilled labor" y'all know what you did calling it unskilled when I've personally witnessed some of y'all break down a lot sooner than expected when you pick up some extra hours in a restaurant because you don't have the skills it takes to cope when you're not doing well much less the skills it takes to do it well.
"Unskilled just means you can teach anyone to do it within a week" okay I can teach anyone to catch a baseball in a week, I'm still gonna fire the people who arent really good at it, and doesn't matter how good you are at catching baseballs when I throw twenty at the same time. Like Jeremy over there can catch five before the rest hit the ground. You caught one and you panicked doing it and almost missed it. Sounds like it's a skill and Jeremy is more skilled than you, so Jeremy keeps his job and I have the unfortunate conversation that it just isn't working out, even though on paper technically I could train a monkey to do it.
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u/PewterButters 23h ago
I haven’t worked somewhere separate sick time in over 20 years. It’s all just lumped as PTO, sick or not you use the same hours.
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u/SmokeyCatDesigns 23h ago
My reaction to this lol. I’ve had zero time off jobs or “general” time off jobs. At the general time off jobs I mostly ended up using my general time on sickness, doctors appointments, jury duty (I constantly get called and it’s very annoying), etc.
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u/riskywhiskey077 19h ago
Yeah but if you use too much of it you get laid off next
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u/meditonsin 21h ago
German here. When I'm sick, my employer has to keep paying me based on my last paycheck for up to six weeks by law. If I'm sick for longer, my health insurance takes over at a slightly lower rate.
A former colleague of mine, who was getting up there in years and had had health issues for a while, was on paid sick leave for 18 months before his insurance provider got him to go into early retirement.
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u/3Grilledjalapenos 22h ago
I recently interviewed at a place that tried to brag about “unlimited PTO”, and then in the office explained that most of them come in when they’re sick, and one guy confessed that the work life balance(including coming in on weekends with no notice) was a contributing factor in his divorce. He’s been there 12 years. He even bragged that he gets a “2% raise every single year, no matter what”. Why do people do this?
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u/CakeDayisaLie 21h ago
If your raise isn’t above inflation for the past year, it ain’t a raise it’s an inflation adjustment.
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u/GreenFox1505 20h ago
it’s an inflation adjustment
Its not even that. Its a demotion.
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u/gargoyle30 20h ago
Demotion is in title, it would be more like a... lower? Like opposite of raise?
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u/Psychological_Ad1518 20h ago
And if you don't get a raise each year to keep up with inflation you're getting a pay cut.
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u/TR_Pix 21h ago
Why do people do this?
Years of hearing that hard work is its own reward and that complaining is for sissies
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u/3Grilledjalapenos 20h ago
He actually told me “I think happiness is a choice”, while also mentioning that he is the noncustodial parent after a divorce.
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u/catsCantCode 19h ago
I worked at a place with unlimited PTO once, and it turned out to be very shady.
They provided unlimited PTO because it meant if someone quit (or got laid off, which happened constantly there) they wouldn't have to pay out accrued time.
The other part of this is that since you don't have a number of hours available ticking up, it winds up feeling harder to take the PTO. My current job has an accrued PTO system and I have been way better about using it than at the place with unlimited, where the culture meant that I took maybe one week a year off besides sick days.
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u/robocultural 18h ago
I'd automatically assume anyone bragging about 2% every year was being sarcastic TBH.
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u/dirtyconcretefloor 1d ago
At my last company they changed the PTO policy for Colorado workers when sick leave got passed there.
They reduced the PTO accrual for everyone in Colorado by 40 hours a year because the law mandated 40 hours of sick pay.
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u/peachesfordinner BumBum Ouchie 23h ago
Oregon did the better version which is that unless you have separate sick leave then the first 40 hours of your PTO is protected and cannot be denied
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u/berse2212 13h ago
You americans are weird. Really this is modern slavery.
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u/Darkmaniako 13h ago
Yeah but slaves there have weapons! Dude you don't get how free they are, they are enslaved but could turn their back to their owner whenever they want!
That's peak freedom! Not rights, no socialism, no healthcare, just freeeeeeedom!
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u/tahlyn 1d ago
This is why I regularly use my sick leave even for minor illnesses and mental health days.
I hold onto about 2 weeks of sick leave at any given time. I have short term and long term disability for any major illness and FMLA will keep my job.
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u/Lastminutebastrd 23h ago
Damn, that reminds me that I gotta use some sick leave. My employer caps us at 112 hours and I've been there for most of the year...
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u/Steppyjim 19h ago
I’m a boss now, and I tell all my people of you got pto USE IT.
Don’t give anything back to the company. You earned that time as much as you earned a paycheck. If you died tomorrow you’d get an email blast about how nice you were and the next day your job would post. This isn’t a family. Use. Your. Time.
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u/leni710 18h ago
I work in a union job and was on the bargaining team this year. We got a lot of data, one of which being the leave hours of staff. About 60% of staff were at multiple dozens, even a hundred or more, hours just in health leave. I made an announcement to people during a union meeting that you are no hero for showing up all the time, you lose all that health leave if you don't work there, mental health leave is also sick time, and most importantly, we could not bargain for an increase in accrual of monthly sick time because the data suggested that people don't use their health leave. This is a drag for people who use a lot of health leave for chronic issues but can't accrue more because their peers refuse to use any health leave. It's a weird scenario.
And yes, I also said to them that the company does not care enough and if they did die tomorrow, their job just gets posted and we forget about you. Like, you owe nothing to me or the company. And the whole "i feel guilty for taking a day off" is such obnoxious boomer nonsense that we really need to throw away. Feel more guilty about spreading your germs or taking out your mental health issues on the group...take a sick day.
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u/emptythoughts94 18h ago
Last year my bosses assured everyone that their sick leave would rollover if unused.
It didn't.
Now I make sure to use every bit of it. Everyone else does too, now we have frequent callouts.
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u/tfp34 1d ago
Does sick leave payout mean getting money for unused sick days?
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u/Supercaptaincat 1d ago
Yes, and it’s a “sometimes” phenomenon, otherwise it may not roll over, often past a certain amount, and not cash out. A “benefit” that may simply disappear if left on the table.
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u/fixer1987 23h ago
I've never worked a job that paid out sick days on leaving. Only vacation leave
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u/Readalie 23h ago
And even if it does get paid out it's still not what it's necessarily worth. My workplace is unionized and has a pretty good contract but even so we only get paid out half the value of our sick time when we leave or retire.
It doesn't expire though which is nice, although we have a cap to balance that out. But the cap on specifically is high enough that I don't know anyone who has hit it even after admin wormed a restriction in against using more than a few days of sick time to care for sick family members.
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u/the_dude_that_faps 21h ago
The amount of shit you Americans put up with is insane. My old parents are the types of people that would tell me as a kid that I should find a way to migrate to places like the US, me being from a poorish country and every time I see shit like this I'm just glad I didn't listen to them.
Fucking nuts.
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u/sexarseshortage 20h ago
Genuinely batshit that people have a set amount of sick leave. If you're sick, you're sick.
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u/FlowerProofYard 22h ago
Is sick time ever paid out? I’ve never been at company where you could bank sick time, maybe the author confused PTO and sick time.
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u/maxdps_ 19h ago
Never worked at a place that gave me PTO and sick time. It's always just been PTO.
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u/ggouge 18h ago
I get 7 sick days and 15 vacation days plus a solo floater day that I can just use.
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u/DaFreakingFox 15h ago
... Your sick days are limited?
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u/424f42_424f42 8h ago
At 100% pay.
Then sort term disability, then long term disability . how much and long for each depends on a lot of things (mine is 90% for 12 weeks, then 50%)
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u/Victor9538 18h ago
In California, sick time is required and must be separate from PTO. Even places that offer “unlimited” PTO have to give you a separate bank of 5 sick days per year.
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u/teaandviolets 18h ago
That's not really true. You can offer PTO only, but you have to allow it to be used in a way that meets the requirements of CA sick leave law. Source - Am HR in a credit union with PTO. Realistically it's a PITA to do, and we're planning to move to separate Vac/Sick banks soon.
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u/Southernbeekeeper 14h ago
This is crazy. I'm in the UK public sector. I get 35 days leave a year (36 next year as I earn a day every year I work here up to 7 years). I also get TOIL and 6 months of full paid sick leave followed by 6 months of half pay.
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u/Destructor2122 19h ago
"I'm sorry, but if you're taking sick leave for more than 2 weeks, you'll need to speak with HR about going on disability or using FMLA. I appreciate your understanding in this matter."
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u/Bansheer5 14h ago
Message back would be hey just so you’re aware we need a doctor’s note explaining why you need to take that amount of time off without using disability and FMLA. If you can’t provide that information for HR we will have to deny your request.
Seen it happen to a coworker of mine. He was dealing with diverticulitis and a cancer scare. Wasn’t much we could do cuz he was just hired and not eligible for disability or fmla yet.
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u/BritishGuy84 1d ago edited 1d ago
I’m assuming this is USA based?
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u/FalenAlter 1d ago
Safe assumption, but I doubt only the US does this.
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u/Dradugun 23h ago
My province in Canada doesn't mandate sick leave be paid out, just paid time off.
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u/ThatInAHat 23h ago
Yeah, they’ve decided to start cracking down on “unscheduled absences” (which you usually use sick leave for because it’s usually when you’re sick)
Kinda blows.
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u/ATLClimb 1d ago
Take FMLA leave and get a doctors approval. You can legally take 8 weeks and they cannot fire you.
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u/Putr 6h ago
It's still incredible to me, that Americans have LIMITED MAXIMUM sick leave ... and you guys are just fine with that?
I mean yeah, company should not cover it ad infinity - there's government or company funded health/social insurance for that - but the idea, that your job is in danger if you get properly sick (like get cancer) is just ... and you are fine with that?
You guys do know you can change that, right? It is YOUR country, the companies are just living in it. You know that right? Right?
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u/LouBarlowsDisease 20h ago
At least in California, employers have to pay out any unused PTO. My max amount of PTO is 276 hours so I try to keep that banked as much as I can just in case I'm laid off.
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u/Icy_Negotiation_5929 20h ago
I’m convinced every business is failing if they have to do this to people.
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u/Bleezy79 22h ago
Realizing the rest of the developed world treats their citizens much better than America. It's wild growing up and realizing you've been sold a lie your whole life.
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u/Bakoro 14h ago
I have one sister who lives in Vietnam most of the year, and Spain part of the year. Another sister moved to Scotland.
Both lived in multiple states, from West to East Coast, urban and rural.
They both agree that living in the U.S is strictly worse in nearly every way as a working person.Worse quality internet connections, worse public transportation, more expensive food for mediocre quality, rent is too damned high everywhere, just a worse quality of life all around.
The land and wildlife of the U.S is incredible, there's a lot to love. There are some cool cities, there's some good arts and culture.
The economics fucking suck, the politics suck, the pervasive selfishness sucks, the lack of community sucks.
The people always whining about how everyone is trying to "destroy our way of life" are the ones attacking the scientists, artists, immigrants, and other folks who make the nation great, and they have destroyed the educational system that made the U.S so powerful.
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u/idrawinmargins 20h ago
I don't have sick time or vaction time. Its called PTO.... You can schedule off days, but more than 8 days sick a year and you're fired. So less sick time and more figure out how to cure your illness in less than a day or two.
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u/fnckIce 20h ago
What a terrible place to spend more time at than anywhere else in your life.
Remember, work is where you live most of your life, don't live in a shithole.
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u/Relevant_Struggle 23h ago
I manage 5 people within the Corp office of a large Corp.
They get 3 weeks pto a d 2 weeks of sick
I told all of them that they can use the sick time for whatever the heck they wanted. I dont care
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u/Certain-Constant5032 22h ago
This happened at a company I worked for. A woman handed in her resignation and 4 weeks notice, got yelled at by the CEO, told she was incompetent blah blah blah (real fucked up stuff) so she was "sick" for the next 4 weeks (literally calling in every day saying she was unwell and unable to make it) until her notice period ended.
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u/mechanical_marten 8h ago
Got fucked over by one place that doesn't pay put PTO or sick days. Missed out on 3 weeks of payable time.
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u/SensitiveJennifer 22h ago
These types of comics make me happy to have been born in Costa Rica, where we have 12 mandatory vacation days per year (one per month) that cannot be accumulated beyond the twelfth month.
If an employer allows or forces their employees to accumulate more than 12 vacation days, they can be sanctioned by the government and even be put out of commission.
We also have unlimited sick days, but only if they are authorized by a doctor who works for the Caja Costarricense de Seguro Social (CCSS) or the government directly, since Costa Rica has a universal healthcare system that covers those types of incidents.
If the sick leave is three days or less, the employer must pay 50% of the employee's daily salary; however, if the employee is sick or incapacitated by the government for more than three days, the CCSS or the government steps in to pay 60% of the employee's salary.
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u/LostnFoundAgainAgain 21h ago
Here in the UK we get 28 days a year for a full time worker, usually this translates to 20 days and 8 bank holidays throughout the year at starting rate, a lot of employers actually tend to increase this, in my last role which I spent a few years at, I had 25 days + 8 bank holidays, so 33 days a year which could not be accumulated.
You are also entitled to sick leave if you have an valid reason and doctors notice, I had 6 weeks off for an operation and got full time pay during that time.
Honestly I don't understand how in the US they don't push for this stuff, it they tried to remove any of this in Europe the country would burn and politicians along with it if necessary as history has shown.
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u/Gangbang8008 14h ago
I don't get the punch line at the end, can someone enlighten me as to what the meaning is?
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u/Ceriden 12h ago
Unused sick time is not paid out (It just expires) at end of year. So person is claiming to be sick, for that amount of time, and just using it as vacation pay.
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u/fuck_this_i_got_shit 12h ago
At the company I was at last they did not pay out for unused sick leave or vacation time. My boss was super chill and so I took my extra time off as my two-weeks notice. HR wasn't in for those weeks either since they were secretly doing the same thing come to find out
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u/PositiveDrag722 14h ago
20 dass minimum PTO (for five days a week, 24 for six) , unlimited sick days (but only 66℅ of your wage after six consecutive weeks). 🙂
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u/Dry_Yam_8049 1d ago
Don’t forget to get a signed doctors note